is this normal? what to do?

Jd205 · 05/30/2010, 11:37 AM

After 4 or 5 days of my parameters showing ph 8.1, 0 trite, 0 amm, and my trate at 20-40 I added 8 small turbos 4 small crabs, and a shrimp. This was 2 days ago. I just tested my parameters and now showing amm .25, trite .5, trate 40. I acclimated by drip method and fresh water dip, and did not put lfs water in my tank. My only guess is that something has died somewhere out of sight or maybe a small spike is normal after adding first livestock. I plan on doing a massive water change as soon as I can. What would you guys do to fix and what else could have caused this? I really dont want anything to die, even if its just a cuc... I am still learning so any thoughts or questions welcome.
Thanks for any help

Palting · 05/30/2010, 11:42 AM

I saw from your prior post that you were day 12 on the 24th. That makes you day 18 today, barely 3 weeks. Your tank is still cycling, buddy.

Unfortunately, it seems you jumped the gun. You have two choices. One, take the CUC back to the LFS for safekeeping, and follow your parameters until that ammonia and trite comes back down. Trate is not such a big deal. Or two, do frequent large water changes to stay ahead of that ammonia, like maybe every other day. This will help keep your CUC alive, but will slow the cycle down.

That's my opinion, only. Maybe someone else has a better handle on it.

Jd205 · 05/30/2010, 11:51 AM

I used fully cured lr and ls and checked my parameters every day. Once I went to 0 on amm and trite I did a 50% water change and checked every day and was still at 0 for 4 days before adding the cuc. I might be new to this but based on everything I have read and the lfs guy's advice, It seems as though the tank had been cycled... Even if its not how are you helping me fix this?

Palting · 05/30/2010, 11:54 AM

Well, I did give you two options in my post. Sorry if I bring you bad news, but like I said, it's just my opinion. Good luck, and believe it or not, I do wish you well.!

schnitm · 05/30/2010, 12:00 PM

Careful that you don't let your ph go up with the water changes if you go this route. Ammonia is all NH3 (toxic) at higher ph(>8.3) and mostly NH4 (not toxic) at lower ph. You noted your ph was 8.1, so it's possible for you to reduce total ammonia with a whater change and end up with MORE toxic water if the ph rises.

Jd205 · 05/30/2010, 12:02 PM

sorry palting, I must have thought the bottum half or your post was your quote or something, but I see it now. Thanks for the help. I am just shocked at the fact that my tank may not have indeed been ready, and it makes me want to not go back to that lfs bc he has been doing this for a while and knew everything about my tank and assured me it was ready. Again, thanks for the advice

jimandjen · 05/30/2010, 12:13 PM

Maybe you could try dosing good bacteria spores everyday as well. I've got something called TLC for saltwater aquariums as well as seachem stability. Haven't tried the former but the later was used to stabilize my QT tank parameters. They are supposed to be designed with good bacteria to reduce your NH3 and and NO4 after 1 week of dosing. Just a thought. And cause it's good bacteria, safe for LR, inverts, and livestock.

Jd205 · 05/30/2010, 12:21 PM

jimandjen- I had been using biozyme for the first week. Sounds like its the same thing your talking about. Thanks and i'll be using that and water changes. The lfs doesnt open again till tuesday and if the problem isnt better by then I will see if they will take the cuc back.

thebkramer · 05/30/2010, 12:31 PM

There is another product called TurboStart for Saltwater Aquariums. Its a bit expensive, but if your LFS or other store carries it, it WILL help. I used it when I had to move everything into a QT and during this process a cycle started. I used the Turbo and it saved (me) many of my tenants. Just my $0.02. This was my experience. You of course, could always bring the CUC back and let the tank do what it needs to do. I would also suggest not to take everything employees at LFS say to heart. Some are only just that...employees, and do not have the experience or expertise of this hobby. Some are there just to get a paycheck. At my LFS, employees get a % of what they sell for the day. Out of 25 employees that I know work there, there is only 3 that I trust for advice, and have their best interest at heart in MY tank. Just be careful and do lots of research! Be patient and you can always get lots of info and advice here at RC!!! We are here to help!

Good Luck!

05/30/2010, 11:37 AM	#1
Jd205 Registered Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: AL Posts: 48	is this normal? what to do? After 4 or 5 days of my parameters showing ph 8.1, 0 trite, 0 amm, and my trate at 20-40 I added 8 small turbos 4 small crabs, and a shrimp. This was 2 days ago. I just tested my parameters and now showing amm .25, trite .5, trate 40. I acclimated by drip method and fresh water dip, and did not put lfs water in my tank. My only guess is that something has died somewhere out of sight or maybe a small spike is normal after adding first livestock. I plan on doing a massive water change as soon as I can. What would you guys do to fix and what else could have caused this? I really dont want anything to die, even if its just a cuc... I am still learning so any thoughts or questions welcome. Thanks for any help

05/30/2010, 11:42 AM	#2
Palting Registered Member Join Date: Apr 2010 Location: Ohio Posts: 6,912	I saw from your prior post that you were day 12 on the 24th. That makes you day 18 today, barely 3 weeks. Your tank is still cycling, buddy. Unfortunately, it seems you jumped the gun. You have two choices. One, take the CUC back to the LFS for safekeeping, and follow your parameters until that ammonia and trite comes back down. Trate is not such a big deal. Or two, do frequent large water changes to stay ahead of that ammonia, like maybe every other day. This will help keep your CUC alive, but will slow the cycle down. That's my opinion, only. Maybe someone else has a better handle on it. __________________ Anything I post is just an opinion. One of many in this hobby. Believe and follow at your own risk of rapid and complete annihilation of all life in your tank :) Current Tank Info: Incept 3/2010, 150 RR, 50g sump, 20g fuge, 150w 15K MH x3, T5 actinics x8, moonlight LED x6, 1400gph return, Koralia 1400 x4, 300 g skimmer, 4 tangs, 2 mandarins, 2 perc, 6 line, 3 cardinals, 2 firefish, SPS, LPS, zoas, palys, shrooms, clam

05/30/2010, 11:54 AM	#4
Palting Registered Member Join Date: Apr 2010 Location: Ohio Posts: 6,912	Well, I did give you two options in my post. Sorry if I bring you bad news, but like I said, it's just my opinion. Good luck, and believe it or not, I do wish you well.! __________________ Anything I post is just an opinion. One of many in this hobby. Believe and follow at your own risk of rapid and complete annihilation of all life in your tank :) Current Tank Info: Incept 3/2010, 150 RR, 50g sump, 20g fuge, 150w 15K MH x3, T5 actinics x8, moonlight LED x6, 1400gph return, Koralia 1400 x4, 300 g skimmer, 4 tangs, 2 mandarins, 2 perc, 6 line, 3 cardinals, 2 firefish, SPS, LPS, zoas, palys, shrooms, clam

05/30/2010, 12:31 PM	#9
thebkramer Registered Member Join Date: Nov 2009 Location: Clifton Park, NY Posts: 3,198	There is another product called TurboStart for Saltwater Aquariums. Its a bit expensive, but if your LFS or other store carries it, it WILL help. I used it when I had to move everything into a QT and during this process a cycle started. I used the Turbo and it saved (me) many of my tenants. Just my $0.02. This was my experience. You of course, could always bring the CUC back and let the tank do what it needs to do. I would also suggest not to take everything employees at LFS say to heart. Some are only just that...employees, and do not have the experience or expertise of this hobby. Some are there just to get a paycheck. At my LFS, employees get a % of what they sell for the day. Out of 25 employees that I know work there, there is only 3 that I trust for advice, and have their best interest at heart in MY tank. Just be careful and do lots of research! Be patient and you can always get lots of info and advice here at RC!!! We are here to help! Good Luck! __________________ Rhonda There is NO such things as Dumb Questions!! There are However.. Dumb Answers!!! ;) ____________ Current Tank Info: 55g reef....Current Orbit SunPaq Lights, HOB Eshopps, HOB AquaClear 110, 2-1400 Koralia Powerheads & 1 Nano Koralia, 40+ lbs LR, 2" LS

05/30/2010, 11:51 AM	#3
Jd205 Registered Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: AL Posts: 48	I used fully cured lr and ls and checked my parameters every day. Once I went to 0 on amm and trite I did a 50% water change and checked every day and was still at 0 for 4 days before adding the cuc. I might be new to this but based on everything I have read and the lfs guy's advice, It seems as though the tank had been cycled... Even if its not how are you helping me fix this?

05/30/2010, 12:00 PM	#5
schnitm Registered Member Join Date: Oct 2009 Location: St. Louis Posts: 104	Careful that you don't let your ph go up with the water changes if you go this route. Ammonia is all NH3 (toxic) at higher ph(>8.3) and mostly NH4 (not toxic) at lower ph. You noted your ph was 8.1, so it's possible for you to reduce total ammonia with a whater change and end up with MORE toxic water if the ph rises.

05/30/2010, 12:02 PM	#6
Jd205 Registered Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: AL Posts: 48	sorry palting, I must have thought the bottum half or your post was your quote or something, but I see it now. Thanks for the help. I am just shocked at the fact that my tank may not have indeed been ready, and it makes me want to not go back to that lfs bc he has been doing this for a while and knew everything about my tank and assured me it was ready. Again, thanks for the advice

05/30/2010, 12:13 PM	#7
jimandjen Registered Member Join Date: Feb 2010 Location: St. Louis, MO USA Posts: 98	Maybe you could try dosing good bacteria spores everyday as well. I've got something called TLC for saltwater aquariums as well as seachem stability. Haven't tried the former but the later was used to stabilize my QT tank parameters. They are supposed to be designed with good bacteria to reduce your NH3 and and NO4 after 1 week of dosing. Just a thought. And cause it's good bacteria, safe for LR, inverts, and livestock.

05/30/2010, 12:21 PM	#8
Jd205 Registered Member Join Date: May 2010 Location: AL Posts: 48	jimandjen- I had been using biozyme for the first week. Sounds like its the same thing your talking about. Thanks and i'll be using that and water changes. The lfs doesnt open again till tuesday and if the problem isnt better by then I will see if they will take the cuc back.