Bare bottom tank pros and cons?

gark666 · 08/26/2011, 10:47 PM

Just want to know the pros and cons of running a reef tank without any kind of substrate, I been siphoning the sand out of my tank every time I do water changes and I'm thinking to leave bare bottom!

Saadatski · 08/26/2011, 11:04 PM

pros- idk about many

cons- it just looks really ugly. Thats my opinion though

Curious George · 08/27/2011, 05:25 AM

Pros- You can point flow at the bottom and keep debris suspended in the water column so the skimmer can eventually get it. Food is more "obvious" to fish if it reaches the bottom. Nothing to absorb and leach.

Cons- Falling rock can break the bottom of the tank if the pieces are big enough. It is not attractive IMO and the tank looks like it needs "something." Burrowing critters never feel comfortable, assuming you have a CUC. No substrate to help with buffering.

doctorgori · 08/27/2011, 07:03 AM

I realize BB tanks are definetly a lil more bullet proof than DSB...but at risk of sounding harsh, why stop there?
...,if a "show case" of corals behind glass is what people want, why not just spray paint them, add water and pool shock and save all the trouble...

IMHO, people with these overly pristine tanks with proped up corals with LR on egg crate racks sorta remind me of those freshwater afficianotos with the flourecent plastic plants and sunken treasure chest...

...may as well add the black lights, balloon mollies and glow fish....

....but to each his own I guess

Fish4Me2 · 08/27/2011, 07:34 AM

Pros - as mentioned before, you can have increased flow and keep more detritus in the water for the skimmer. You also never have to worry about siphoning/replacing/cleaning your sandbed, which was one of my least favorite tasks. You can always see and siphon out any junk on the bottom. You can put something solid on the bottom of the tank (like starboard) to protect the glass.

Cons - it's uglier. You can't have fish that need sand. In my case, I appear to have fewer pods, because the fish can see them easier. From what I've read, you'll have less stability.

Having said that I've been BB for over a year now and love how much easier it is to clean the tank.

barjam · 08/27/2011, 07:49 AM

When you make the switch from a sand tank to BB it takes a year. Yes a year for all the nasty crap locked into the rocks to come out (cooking them is much faster obviously).

A sand bed in my opinion is a huge, huge negative and the only positives are aesthetics and keeping of sand loving creatures.

In my case my tank is situated such that even if I had sand you wouldn't see it.

doctorgori · 08/27/2011, 08:04 AM

Gark666 you gotta revisit your goals for a reef tank in the 1st place...
is it specifically for raising corals or is it for aestetics or both?

people that expound one way or another always seem to ommit thier goal....

....if your goal is in replication of a reef, I can't see a tank w/o sand....
...if your goal is nice corals with as easy/simplified maintenance then BB is easier....

people that say DSB don't work likley screwed up somewhere and gloss over all the BB tanks that likewise screw up

people that say you can't easily have reduce nitrates with BB usually likewise slack on thier maintenance...

I've done both (my 1st reef tank was aound 1985).... the differences ain't that much

revstu · 08/27/2011, 08:29 AM

I did barebottom (starboard) in my 75 reef for three years and then when I moved my tank I went to sand. The barebottom is great for keeping your tank clean because I would siphon out any junk off the bottom when I did my water changes. But now that I added sand I like the way it looks MUCH better.

biecacka · 08/27/2011, 09:30 AM

i currently have a BB tank. i love it!! it does have its pros and cons, i have gsp and shrooms growing on the bottom of the tank so its hard to blast the crap outta the bottom of the tank cause i dont wanna upset them so i find myself syphoning more than id like.

i do like the look of sand just dont wanna carry enough bags into my house to put it in!!
LOL

Jeff000 · 08/27/2011, 09:38 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fish4Me2

You also never have to worry about siphoning/replacing/cleaning your sandbed, which was one of my least favorite tasks.

Having said that I've been BB for over a year now and love how much easier it is to clean the tank.

My tank has been running for 1 year and 1 month now.
I have yet to take any water from my display tank. Water changes come from my sump. Every 3 months I will run a sock for a few days and then use a power head to blow off the rocks a bit, but I have never siphoned my sand. Nor does anyone I know. that is what the cuc is for.

My goal is a reef looking tank, I love the look of the sand.
I have a 1.5-2" sand bed.

barjam · 08/27/2011, 09:47 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by doctorgori

Gark666 you gotta revisit your goals for a reef tank in the 1st place...
is it specifically for raising corals or is it for aestetics or both?

people that expound one way or another always seem to ommit thier goal....

....if your goal is in replication of a reef, I can't see a tank w/o sand....
...if your goal is nice corals with as easy/simplified maintenance then BB is easier....

people that say DSB don't work likley screwed up somewhere and gloss over all the BB tanks that likewise screw up

people that say you can't easily have reduce nitrates with BB usually likewise slack on thier maintenance...

I've done both (my 1st reef tank was aound 1985).... the differences ain't that much

It depends on what you are replicating. Many corals don't live near the sand they live up on the top of the rocks far from any sand.

Potsy · 08/27/2011, 10:26 AM

I've done sand and bb. Regardless of the highly subjective matter of what looks better, I found that:

- Sand makes for more microfauna diversity but is higher maintenance. It eventually turns into a nutrient sink. Detrivores don't have an infinite capacity to reduce nutrients... eventually mulm builds up that has to be removed. Having a sandbed makes that more labor intensive.

- Certain gobies, wrasses, and anemones need a sandbed.

- It's easier to mount lps corals upright in a sandbed.

- With my current bb/starboard tank, I have almost complete control over my water's nutrient levels. Other than some patches of cyano from carbon dosing, I have no nuisance algae and only clean the glass once every week or two. My white starboard bottom, at a glance, mimics the sand/rock contrast that looks more natural.

- With my bb, I can't keep fairy wrasses or gobies, and I like both. I'd like to try my hand at a sebae anemone, but wouldn't want to risk it without sand.

Overall, unless I wanted those species that require sand, I'd setup another tank with bb/starboard. I don't miss sand in and of itself.

pico-reefer · 08/27/2011, 10:42 AM

Why dont you either make or buy a shallow container, and fill it with sand and put it either in a corner or behind rocks where you cant see it, so your snails and other inverts can still sift through, you get some buffering capability, but you still have the ease of a BB

gark666 · 08/27/2011, 02:37 PM

Thanks a lot for the replies, the only reason I want to remove the sand is because of my power heads I currenly have two MP40 in my tank and I had them running at about 50% anything higher than that just blows the sand everywhere making a mess in the tank, and my sps look better with higher flow too!

Jeff000 · 08/27/2011, 03:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by gark666

Thanks a lot for the replies, the only reason I want to remove the sand is because of my power heads I currenly have two MP40 in my tank and I had them running at about 50% anything higher than that just blows the sand everywhere making a mess in the tank, and my sps look better with higher flow too!

That is a lot of flow for a small tank, and you have no ability to control that flow direction with the MP's, if you had tunze's you could get much more flow without disrupting the sand bed. I find the MP's far too loud anyways.

tomaquar · 08/27/2011, 09:55 PM

I am a big fan of BB. I cut travertine tiles to fit the bottom and seal with epoxy putty. Got some flat bottom rocks from Marcos rocks the put a few strips of plexi glass under this base to hold it up about 1/4 inch, and then built on top of this. Water flows under well and you can keep the detritus to a minimum.

The tile protects the glass from falling rock.

If you look you can find tile with interesting fossils. When coraline starts to grow it looks very nice.

08/26/2011, 10:47 PM	#1
gark666 Registered Member Join Date: Mar 2011 Location: Colorado springs CO Posts: 180	Bare bottom tank pros and cons? Just want to know the pros and cons of running a reef tank without any kind of substrate, I been siphoning the sand out of my tank every time I do water changes and I'm thinking to leave bare bottom! __________________ empty pocket, reef tank happy, no problem! Current Tank Info: 38 nuvo

08/26/2011, 11:04 PM	#2
Saadatski Registered Member Join Date: Jun 2011 Posts: 875	pros- idk about many cons- it just looks really ugly. Thats my opinion though __________________ 75 gallon FOWLR for now- 2x250w MH Current USA Outer Orbit with T5 actinic, Vortech MP40

08/27/2011, 02:37 PM	#14
gark666 Registered Member Join Date: Mar 2011 Location: Colorado springs CO Posts: 180	Thanks a lot for the replies, the only reason I want to remove the sand is because of my power heads I currenly have two MP40 in my tank and I had them running at about 50% anything higher than that just blows the sand everywhere making a mess in the tank, and my sps look better with higher flow too! __________________ empty pocket, reef tank happy, no problem! Current Tank Info: 38 nuvo

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08/27/2011, 05:25 AM	#3
Curious George Registered Member Join Date: Jun 2011 Posts: 748	Pros- You can point flow at the bottom and keep debris suspended in the water column so the skimmer can eventually get it. Food is more "obvious" to fish if it reaches the bottom. Nothing to absorb and leach. Cons- Falling rock can break the bottom of the tank if the pieces are big enough. It is not attractive IMO and the tank looks like it needs "something." Burrowing critters never feel comfortable, assuming you have a CUC. No substrate to help with buffering.

08/27/2011, 07:03 AM	#4
doctorgori Moved On Join Date: Jun 2011 Location: Simon Bar-Sinistar Posts: 1,097	I realize BB tanks are definetly a lil more bullet proof than DSB...but at risk of sounding harsh, why stop there? ...,if a "show case" of corals behind glass is what people want, why not just spray paint them, add water and pool shock and save all the trouble... IMHO, people with these overly pristine tanks with proped up corals with LR on egg crate racks sorta remind me of those freshwater afficianotos with the flourecent plastic plants and sunken treasure chest... ...may as well add the black lights, balloon mollies and glow fish.... ....but to each his own I guess

08/27/2011, 07:34 AM	#5
Fish4Me2 Registered Member Join Date: Nov 2007 Location: TwinCities Posts: 650	Pros - as mentioned before, you can have increased flow and keep more detritus in the water for the skimmer. You also never have to worry about siphoning/replacing/cleaning your sandbed, which was one of my least favorite tasks. You can always see and siphon out any junk on the bottom. You can put something solid on the bottom of the tank (like starboard) to protect the glass. Cons - it's uglier. You can't have fish that need sand. In my case, I appear to have fewer pods, because the fish can see them easier. From what I've read, you'll have less stability. Having said that I've been BB for over a year now and love how much easier it is to clean the tank.

08/27/2011, 07:49 AM	#6
barjam Registered Member Join Date: Jan 2002 Posts: 1,695	When you make the switch from a sand tank to BB it takes a year. Yes a year for all the nasty crap locked into the rocks to come out (cooking them is much faster obviously). A sand bed in my opinion is a huge, huge negative and the only positives are aesthetics and keeping of sand loving creatures. In my case my tank is situated such that even if I had sand you wouldn't see it.

08/27/2011, 08:04 AM	#7
doctorgori Moved On Join Date: Jun 2011 Location: Simon Bar-Sinistar Posts: 1,097	Gark666 you gotta revisit your goals for a reef tank in the 1st place... is it specifically for raising corals or is it for aestetics or both? people that expound one way or another always seem to ommit thier goal.... ....if your goal is in replication of a reef, I can't see a tank w/o sand.... ...if your goal is nice corals with as easy/simplified maintenance then BB is easier.... people that say DSB don't work likley screwed up somewhere and gloss over all the BB tanks that likewise screw up people that say you can't easily have reduce nitrates with BB usually likewise slack on thier maintenance... I've done both (my 1st reef tank was aound 1985).... the differences ain't that much

08/27/2011, 08:29 AM	#8
revstu Registered Member Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Iowa Posts: 80	I did barebottom (starboard) in my 75 reef for three years and then when I moved my tank I went to sand. The barebottom is great for keeping your tank clean because I would siphon out any junk off the bottom when I did my water changes. But now that I added sand I like the way it looks MUCH better.

08/27/2011, 09:30 AM	#9
biecacka Registered Member Join Date: May 2008 Location: Columbus Ohio Posts: 6,361	i currently have a BB tank. i love it!! it does have its pros and cons, i have gsp and shrooms growing on the bottom of the tank so its hard to blast the crap outta the bottom of the tank cause i dont wanna upset them so i find myself syphoning more than id like. i do like the look of sand just dont wanna carry enough bags into my house to put it in!! LOL

08/27/2011, 10:26 AM	#12
Potsy Registered Member Join Date: Jun 2001 Location: Kinnelon, NJ Posts: 1,827	I've done sand and bb. Regardless of the highly subjective matter of what looks better, I found that: - Sand makes for more microfauna diversity but is higher maintenance. It eventually turns into a nutrient sink. Detrivores don't have an infinite capacity to reduce nutrients... eventually mulm builds up that has to be removed. Having a sandbed makes that more labor intensive. - Certain gobies, wrasses, and anemones need a sandbed. - It's easier to mount lps corals upright in a sandbed. - With my current bb/starboard tank, I have almost complete control over my water's nutrient levels. Other than some patches of cyano from carbon dosing, I have no nuisance algae and only clean the glass once every week or two. My white starboard bottom, at a glance, mimics the sand/rock contrast that looks more natural. - With my bb, I can't keep fairy wrasses or gobies, and I like both. I'd like to try my hand at a sebae anemone, but wouldn't want to risk it without sand. Overall, unless I wanted those species that require sand, I'd setup another tank with bb/starboard. I don't miss sand in and of itself.

08/27/2011, 10:42 AM	#13
pico-reefer Registered Member Join Date: Jan 2010 Location: nj Posts: 334	Why dont you either make or buy a shallow container, and fill it with sand and put it either in a corner or behind rocks where you cant see it, so your snails and other inverts can still sift through, you get some buffering capability, but you still have the ease of a BB

08/27/2011, 09:55 PM	#16
tomaquar Registered Member Join Date: Jan 2005 Posts: 140	I am a big fan of BB. I cut travertine tiles to fit the bottom and seal with epoxy putty. Got some flat bottom rocks from Marcos rocks the put a few strips of plexi glass under this base to hold it up about 1/4 inch, and then built on top of this. Water flows under well and you can keep the detritus to a minimum. The tile protects the glass from falling rock. If you look you can find tile with interesting fossils. When coraline starts to grow it looks very nice.