alleged toxic tangs

etepperman · 09/08/2011, 09:13 AM

Hi,

Can anyone tell me which of the common tangs are alleged to have toxic barbs.
In particular does the Naso Tang?

I know that many people don't think tangs are toxic at all but, I have little ones in the house and don't want to take any chances with toxic fish.

Thanks,
Elliott

nuclearheli · 09/08/2011, 09:31 AM

Tangs can be "VENOMOUS". Not poisonous.

From what I can find only in hippo tangs were venom glands found, while others merely have apparent venom delivery morphology and not necessarily venom glands.

Also, venom can be very mild to perhaps fatal depending on the subject, the amount of venom, injection site, and of course the strength of the venom. Most reported stings result in mild to significant swelling and a lot of pain. Running the area under warm to hot water seems to neutralize the venom and help. If you look around the web you will find cases where people have actually gone to the hospital resulting from a sting, rarely do you hear of any fatal cases. I personally have not come across any. Keep in mind many fish are venomous. For example, the foxface or rabbit fish have some nasty spines capable of delivering quite a lot of pain.

From what I hear from others Sohal tangs are the worst.

etepperman · 09/08/2011, 10:30 AM

Thanks. Anyone else have any feedback?

rogermccray · 09/08/2011, 10:32 AM

Just keep a top on the tank and don't let your kids put their hands in....with the size of tank you need for a tang, especially a naso tang, your kids are not going to be able to reach to the top of a tank. My wife runs a daycare out of the house and there is no way that the kids can get their hands near the tank opening....

rogermccray · 09/08/2011, 10:33 AM

well not a top but a covering they can't get their hands through.

etepperman · 09/08/2011, 03:14 PM

Hi,

It is actually jumping that concerns me, not hands in the tank.

I also tried to put on a cover, but lost a lot of light, and it complete ruined the look of the rimless tank.

So, back the initial question. Does anyone know if the Naso tang is venomous?

Thanks,
Elliott

iyachtuxivm · 09/08/2011, 05:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by etepperman

Hi,

It is actually jumping that concerns me, not hands in the tank.

I also tried to put on a cover, but lost a lot of light, and it complete ruined the look of the rimless tank.

So, back the initial question. Does anyone know if the Naso tang is venomous?

Thanks,
Elliott

No they are not. They do have scaples that can cause a wicked cut which can very easily get infected by what is on them. The scaples are not hollow so no way to deliver venom. They do have spines along thier back and anal arays that are hollow like most fish (fresh included) but no know venom sacks.

snorvich · 09/08/2011, 06:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by iyachtuxivm

No they are not. They do have scaples that can cause a wicked cut which can very easily get infected by what is on them. The scaples are not hollow so no way to deliver venom. They do have spines along thier back and anal arays that are hollow like most fish (fresh included) but no know venom sacks.

That is also my understanding. The scalpels can inflict a serious wound, although Naso's are not aggressive in this regard.

Lynnmw1208 · 09/08/2011, 06:18 PM

my understanding was that rabbit fish have venomous spines on their dorsal fins but the scalpels on tangs are not venomous.

InsaneClownFish · 09/08/2011, 09:18 PM

You won't need to worry about Tangs jumping with a rimless tank. You may and will get splashed with water though.

Hormigaquatica · 09/08/2011, 09:21 PM

Short answer- nobody has proven that any Naso species are venomous.

There is conflicting information about tangs being venomous for a number different reasons. One is that not all species are venomous, so you can't generalize about the entire group. Two is that for those which have been found with venom glands, the glands are Very small and apparently easily missed in necropsy (meaning more species than currently known may be venomous, we just can't tell yet). Three, at least some tangs appear to be toxic for just a portion of their life (like the Convict Tang), losing that potency as they mature. The last point is that, as mentioned earlier in this thread, tangs don't have hollow scalpels. However, some of the tangs have grooves along the spines that channel venom into the attackers/victims wound (the same way that many hot snakes have grooves in their fangs to channel venom into a bite, rather than use hollow teeth).

09/08/2011, 09:13 AM	#1
etepperman Registered Member Join Date: Sep 2010 Posts: 257	alleged toxic tangs Hi, Can anyone tell me which of the common tangs are alleged to have toxic barbs. In particular does the Naso Tang? I know that many people don't think tangs are toxic at all but, I have little ones in the house and don't want to take any chances with toxic fish. Thanks, Elliott

09/08/2011, 06:18 PM	#9
Lynnmw1208 Registered Member Join Date: Aug 2010 Location: Brunswick, Ohio Posts: 3,306	my understanding was that rabbit fish have venomous spines on their dorsal fins but the scalpels on tangs are not venomous. __________________ equipment: Eshopps psk-200 skimmer, Mag 12 pump, 30gal sump, 2x 300w Finnex heaters, glass-holes 1500gph overflow kit with 3/4" return kits, 72" 8x36w t-5 AquaticLife light, 66lbs of LR, 150lbs of tropic eden reeflakes, 2 Koralia Evo 1400, JBJ ATO, BRS dual GFO/carbon reactors, Hydor smartwave Current Tank Info: 125gallon

09/08/2011, 09:18 PM	#10
InsaneClownFish Registered Member Join Date: Oct 2003 Posts: 5,069	You won't need to worry about Tangs jumping with a rimless tank. You may and will get splashed with water though. __________________ 7 Years Reefing and Many Fresh 8 Foot Envisions

09/08/2011, 09:21 PM	#11
Hormigaquatica Registered Member Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: Columbus, OH Posts: 3,022	Short answer- nobody has proven that any Naso species are venomous. There is conflicting information about tangs being venomous for a number different reasons. One is that not all species are venomous, so you can't generalize about the entire group. Two is that for those which have been found with venom glands, the glands are Very small and apparently easily missed in necropsy (meaning more species than currently known may be venomous, we just can't tell yet). Three, at least some tangs appear to be toxic for just a portion of their life (like the Convict Tang), losing that potency as they mature. The last point is that, as mentioned earlier in this thread, tangs don't have hollow scalpels. However, some of the tangs have grooves along the spines that channel venom into the attackers/victims wound (the same way that many hot snakes have grooves in their fangs to channel venom into a bite, rather than use hollow teeth). __________________ Reaching up and reaching out and reaching for the random, or whatever will bewilder me. Have Some Personal Accountability Current Tank Info: 240g LPS/Softie Reef

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09/08/2011, 09:31 AM	#2
nuclearheli Registered Member Join Date: Jul 2010 Location: Cream Ridge NJ Posts: 878	Tangs can be "VENOMOUS". Not poisonous. From what I can find only in hippo tangs were venom glands found, while others merely have apparent venom delivery morphology and not necessarily venom glands. Also, venom can be very mild to perhaps fatal depending on the subject, the amount of venom, injection site, and of course the strength of the venom. Most reported stings result in mild to significant swelling and a lot of pain. Running the area under warm to hot water seems to neutralize the venom and help. If you look around the web you will find cases where people have actually gone to the hospital resulting from a sting, rarely do you hear of any fatal cases. I personally have not come across any. Keep in mind many fish are venomous. For example, the foxface or rabbit fish have some nasty spines capable of delivering quite a lot of pain. From what I hear from others Sohal tangs are the worst.

09/08/2011, 10:30 AM	#3
etepperman Registered Member Join Date: Sep 2010 Posts: 257	Thanks. Anyone else have any feedback?

09/08/2011, 10:32 AM	#4
rogermccray Registered Member Join Date: Aug 2011 Posts: 1,050	Just keep a top on the tank and don't let your kids put their hands in....with the size of tank you need for a tang, especially a naso tang, your kids are not going to be able to reach to the top of a tank. My wife runs a daycare out of the house and there is no way that the kids can get their hands near the tank opening....

09/08/2011, 10:33 AM	#5
rogermccray Registered Member Join Date: Aug 2011 Posts: 1,050	well not a top but a covering they can't get their hands through.

09/08/2011, 03:14 PM	#6
etepperman Registered Member Join Date: Sep 2010 Posts: 257	Hi, It is actually jumping that concerns me, not hands in the tank. I also tried to put on a cover, but lost a lot of light, and it complete ruined the look of the rimless tank. So, back the initial question. Does anyone know if the Naso tang is venomous? Thanks, Elliott