Kalk..simply.

puffer911 · 11/22/2011, 11:05 AM

As the name implies, we are talking Kalk...

As I have been dosing Kalk (Kents Kalkwasser mix) I use a BPA Clear water approved container that is see through. A picture of what it tends to look like 24 hours after mixing is included in the post. I usually go ahead and dose even though I do not get the "clear" layer that many reference, there is no crust layer on top.

BTW this is drip method into sump.

When I do usually go to flush and refill (yes with RO/DI) I see some powdery residue move around at bottom.

These are the ideas I have:

1) That since my container is closed, it does not allow the mixture to receive CO2 and thus not dissolve particulates and become clear.

2) That since I dose 2 TSP of Kalk per gallon, maybe its hitting its precipitation point. The RO/DI water has less than .10 TDS

3) I have tried just tilting container to mix, and shaking to no avail.

What I also notice is that PH fluctuation is minimal at best. PH is 8.15 and may jump to 8.16-17 With a 3-4 drop per second drip. Mag and Calc is 1260 and 360 respectively. Should I try to increase?

What suggestions if at all?

NaH2Ofreak · 11/22/2011, 11:13 AM

Shake the container more vigorously. Allow to settle with lid off. It should be clear, with a "crust" on top and a bunch of precipitate/left over kalk powder at the bottom. If solution is saturated, it will have a pH over 12.

Dennis

puffer911 · 11/22/2011, 12:20 PM

Thanks Dennis. Will report back...I shook the container and opened. As of 2 hours ago. Will re-post later tonight. Is it necessary for a 24 hour wait? Also should PH be climbing or maintained? I would enjoy a PH of at least 8.25+

Randy Holmes-Farley · 11/22/2011, 02:25 PM

What is the container made of?

Polycarbonate is unsuitable for limewater as the high pH will eventually degrade it to the point it cracks and fails.

Randy Holmes-Farley · 11/22/2011, 02:27 PM

That since my container is closed, it does not allow the mixture to receive CO2 and thus not dissolve particulates and become clear.

No. Mixing with air will cause additional precipitate.

It is normal to have insolubles remain.

puffer911 · 11/22/2011, 08:54 PM

So at this time, est 10:00 pm...

There is a visible layer that is partly opaque on the top, not really a distinguishable layer on the bottom.

Also the middle is about the same in cloudiness. If this is OK, then I wont worry about it.

Misled · 11/22/2011, 09:05 PM

You can also save some money by using this.

For some reason I'm getting a lot of use on that pic this week!!!

puffer911 · 11/22/2011, 09:39 PM

Yeah, def saw that option. Our LFS "Fish Doctors" carries the Kent kind. Its a bit for my 55 + 30 sump... I just hope that this has some potency.

NaH2Ofreak · 11/22/2011, 11:54 PM

Randy is definitely the Kalk expert but, I would say it is fine to use now. Just draw off the middle and not the bottom of the container.

Dennis

Randy Holmes-Farley · 11/23/2011, 06:55 AM

As long as limewater has been allowed to settle overnight, I'd use it whether it is totally clear or not. The largest hunks will have settled out. A scum on top is also normal.

These have more info:

What Your Grandmother Never Told You About Lime
http://reefkeeping.com/issues/2005-01/rhf/index.htm

The Self Purification of Limewater (Kalkwasser)
http://www.advancedaquarist.com/issues/may2003/chem.htm

The Degradation of Limewater (Kalkwasser) in Air
http://reefkeeping.com/issues/2003-0...ture/index.htm

Magnesium and Strontium in Limewater
http://www.advancedaquarist.com/issues/dec2003/chem.htm

What is that Precipitate in My Reef Aquarium?
http://reefkeeping.com/issues/2005-07/rhf/index.htm

from the last one:

Figure 5. A view of my limewater reservoir showing a thin calcium carbonate crust on part of the liquid surface, and heavy deposits of calcium carbonate, calcium hydroxide, magnesium hydroxide, and other materials on the bottom. I clean out the bottom of the reservoir only once a year or so.

11/22/2011, 11:05 AM	#1
puffer911 Registered Member Join Date: Nov 2011 Posts: 8	Kalk..simply. As the name implies, we are talking Kalk... As I have been dosing Kalk (Kents Kalkwasser mix) I use a BPA Clear water approved container that is see through. A picture of what it tends to look like 24 hours after mixing is included in the post. I usually go ahead and dose even though I do not get the "clear" layer that many reference, there is no crust layer on top. BTW this is drip method into sump. When I do usually go to flush and refill (yes with RO/DI) I see some powdery residue move around at bottom. These are the ideas I have: 1) That since my container is closed, it does not allow the mixture to receive CO2 and thus not dissolve particulates and become clear. 2) That since I dose 2 TSP of Kalk per gallon, maybe its hitting its precipitation point. The RO/DI water has less than .10 TDS 3) I have tried just tilting container to mix, and shaking to no avail. What I also notice is that PH fluctuation is minimal at best. PH is 8.15 and may jump to 8.16-17 With a 3-4 drop per second drip. Mag and Calc is 1260 and 360 respectively. Should I try to increase? What suggestions if at all?

11/22/2011, 02:25 PM	#4
Randy Holmes-Farley Reef Chemist Join Date: Apr 2001 Location: Arlington, Massachusetts Posts: 86,233	What is the container made of? Polycarbonate is unsuitable for limewater as the high pH will eventually degrade it to the point it cracks and fails. __________________ Randy Holmes-Farley Current Tank Info: 120 mixed reef

11/22/2011, 02:27 PM	#5
Randy Holmes-Farley Reef Chemist Join Date: Apr 2001 Location: Arlington, Massachusetts Posts: 86,233	That since my container is closed, it does not allow the mixture to receive CO2 and thus not dissolve particulates and become clear. No. Mixing with air will cause additional precipitate. It is normal to have insolubles remain. __________________ Randy Holmes-Farley Current Tank Info: 120 mixed reef

11/22/2011, 08:54 PM	#6
puffer911 Registered Member Join Date: Nov 2011 Posts: 8	Update So at this time, est 10:00 pm... There is a visible layer that is partly opaque on the top, not really a distinguishable layer on the bottom. Also the middle is about the same in cloudiness. If this is OK, then I wont worry about it.

11/22/2011, 09:05 PM	#7
Misled RC Mod Join Date: Oct 2006 Location: Pittsburgh, Pa Posts: 11,440 Blog Entries: 11	You can also save some money by using this. For some reason I'm getting a lot of use on that pic this week!!! __________________ Jesse I'm not saying I'm Batman. I'm just saying nobody has ever seen me and Batman in a room together.

11/22/2011, 11:13 AM	#2
NaH2Ofreak Premium Member Join Date: Sep 2000 Location: Portland, OR Posts: 1,468	Shake the container more vigorously. Allow to settle with lid off. It should be clear, with a "crust" on top and a bunch of precipitate/left over kalk powder at the bottom. If solution is saturated, it will have a pH over 12. Dennis

11/22/2011, 12:20 PM	#3
puffer911 Registered Member Join Date: Nov 2011 Posts: 8	Thanks Dennis. Will report back...I shook the container and opened. As of 2 hours ago. Will re-post later tonight. Is it necessary for a 24 hour wait? Also should PH be climbing or maintained? I would enjoy a PH of at least 8.25+

11/22/2011, 09:39 PM	#8
puffer911 Registered Member Join Date: Nov 2011 Posts: 8	Yeah, def saw that option. Our LFS "Fish Doctors" carries the Kent kind. Its a bit for my 55 + 30 sump... I just hope that this has some potency.

11/22/2011, 11:54 PM	#9
NaH2Ofreak Premium Member Join Date: Sep 2000 Location: Portland, OR Posts: 1,468	Randy is definitely the Kalk expert but, I would say it is fine to use now. Just draw off the middle and not the bottom of the container. Dennis

11/23/2011, 06:55 AM	#10
Randy Holmes-Farley Reef Chemist Join Date: Apr 2001 Location: Arlington, Massachusetts Posts: 86,233	As long as limewater has been allowed to settle overnight, I'd use it whether it is totally clear or not. The largest hunks will have settled out. A scum on top is also normal. These have more info: What Your Grandmother Never Told You About Lime http://reefkeeping.com/issues/2005-01/rhf/index.htm The Self Purification of Limewater (Kalkwasser) http://www.advancedaquarist.com/issues/may2003/chem.htm The Degradation of Limewater (Kalkwasser) in Air http://reefkeeping.com/issues/2003-0...ture/index.htm Magnesium and Strontium in Limewater http://www.advancedaquarist.com/issues/dec2003/chem.htm What is that Precipitate in My Reef Aquarium? http://reefkeeping.com/issues/2005-07/rhf/index.htm from the last one: Figure 5. A view of my limewater reservoir showing a thin calcium carbonate crust on part of the liquid surface, and heavy deposits of calcium carbonate, calcium hydroxide, magnesium hydroxide, and other materials on the bottom. I clean out the bottom of the reservoir only once a year or so. __________________ Randy Holmes-Farley Current Tank Info: 120 mixed reef