Cloudy QT - help?

WetShepherd · 12/14/2011, 12:04 PM

I've never had cloudy water so I'm not sure what to do with this - or what it's effects may be on the fish I have in QT. Here's the specs:

20g Glass tank
Heater
HOB filter with 2 carbon pads and 1 biowheel (seeded)
Box of ceramic media (seeded) - lots of spaces for water flow
1 Koralia Nano
Fake 'rock' - aquarium grade - opted for this instead of pvc since the tank was up for so long
PH is 8.1
Ammonia, Nitrites and Nitrates at 0 or undetectable
Ammo and Nitrite tests are API
Nitrate test is Salifert
Nothing goes in the tank except salt water, RODI top offs and a very small amount of brine shrimp (thawed and rinsed in rodi)

The tank has been running for a couple of months with no fish in it and the water has remained clear. I had both the bio wheel and the ceramic media in my sump for a few weeks before that. Ghost feeding pellets and brine failed to generate ammonia - only trace amounts of nitrates. The tank has been cycled for more than a month.

I added a Bangai/Kaudern's Cardinal (Pterapogon kauderni) last friday (almost a week ago). Three days in the water was a little bit cloudy. Four days in, the water was very cloudy. To be specific, it is uniformly cloudy - I can't see what is making it that way - the particles are too fine. I've done 50% water changes both yesterday and the day before with no effect. I'm changing the filters weekly. I don't believe it's an alk problem as I'm not dosing - the only thing going in is the salt water, rodi and very small amounts of food.

The only thing I could think it would be is algae suspended in the water column - but I would have expected the water change to instantly improve that.

Any insights?

jon99 · 12/14/2011, 12:23 PM

I would just keep my eye on the fish and test the water regularly to make sure ammonia, nitrit, and nitrate don't spike up. You could rubber band a filter sock with some carbon in it over the end of a small power head and drop it in to see if that helps clear the water. As far as what it is... maybe just an algae bloom like you're suspecting.

WetShepherd · 12/14/2011, 02:12 PM

Thanks - I never considered using the PH like that. I have a couple of carbon pads in the HOB so maybe I can try something else on the PH like chemi-pure.

Reefing Newbie · 12/14/2011, 05:03 PM

What color cloudy? If it is a whitish kind of cloudy it is probably a bacteria bloom. When you added the two cardinals you dramatically increased the bio load compared to what the frozen brine shrimp and pellets for ghost feedings were doing. If they failed to cause ammonia you probably didn't add enough food for the invisible fish. I would stop doing the WCs and wait it out because 50% changes will mean that more water needs to be populated with this bacteria. Test frequently and make sure non of the water perameters are off.

WetShepherd · 12/14/2011, 11:40 PM

Just one cardinal, but yes, point taken. And yes, I would characterize it as white, though certainly not snow white. I've always thought the bacteria existed on surfaces (sand and rocks) - but I can see how if I removed it from the water column with a water change, that is where the algae would grow because that is where the unprocessed nutrients would be. And of course I still wouldn't be detecting ammonia/trites/trates because it's actively being used by the algae. Is that right?

Reefing Newbie · 12/15/2011, 09:26 AM

Your algae idea is right, not an expert on that. The bacteria do eventually and are on surfaces. But when you get a bloom, the surfaces aren't large enough for all the bacteria. Eventually the balance comes in and you don't have the cloudy water. This is my theory at least. Being that it is more whatever than green, I am going to put a vote in for bacteria. Algae would mean green water I believe.

Chris27 · 12/15/2011, 01:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Reefing Newbie

Your algae idea is right, not an expert on that. The bacteria do eventually and are on surfaces. But when you get a bloom, the surfaces aren't large enough for all the bacteria. Eventually the balance comes in and you don't have the cloudy water. This is my theory at least. Being that it is more whatever than green, I am going to put a vote in for bacteria. Algae would mean green water I believe.

I too think it's bacteria. Monitor the ammonia carefully, as the level can and likely will go up if the bio-filter is establishing.

stingythingy45 · 12/15/2011, 01:24 PM

Yup,sounds like a bacteria bloom.It can be a pain as it will get so cloudy you might not be able to monitor the fish.Water changes will only clear it for a short time and it will come right back.I knocked out a algae bloom with a U.V. sterilizer.
If you can borrow one,I'd give that a try.

WetShepherd · 12/19/2011, 07:19 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by stingythingy45

Yup,sounds like a bacteria bloom.It can be a pain as it will get so cloudy you might not be able to monitor the fish.Water changes will only clear it for a short time and it will come right back.I knocked out a algae bloom with a U.V. sterilizer.
If you can borrow one,I'd give that a try.

haha you definitely called that one. I had to move the little guy to my backup QT, but I've left the current one running to see what happens - and it's become so cloudy it's hard to see the hob filter through the tank. The backup isn't cycled and is only 10g but the fish is so small that maintenance has been easy. That being said I have a few decisions to make.

First, I could move the ceramic media from the cloudy 20g to the un-cycled 10g and it would probably transfer the cycle eliminating any ammonia concerns. Would this also cause another bacteria bloom in the 10g tank though?

Second is, how to go about rectifying the 20g tank. I don't have a source to borrow a UV filter from. I would consider buying one if there were a purpose to be served in my DT. What are my other options? If I pull the two filter pads and the ceramic media, leaving only the bio wheel and do a 100% water change, am I good to wait for the cycle to complete again, or am I likely to get another bloom from from the bio wheel?

Thank you for the help with this guys - very much appreciated.

12/14/2011, 12:04 PM	#1
WetShepherd Registered Member Join Date: Jul 2011 Location: Ottawa, Canada Posts: 522 Blog Entries: 5	Cloudy QT - help? I've never had cloudy water so I'm not sure what to do with this - or what it's effects may be on the fish I have in QT. Here's the specs: 20g Glass tank Heater HOB filter with 2 carbon pads and 1 biowheel (seeded) Box of ceramic media (seeded) - lots of spaces for water flow 1 Koralia Nano Fake 'rock' - aquarium grade - opted for this instead of pvc since the tank was up for so long PH is 8.1 Ammonia, Nitrites and Nitrates at 0 or undetectable Ammo and Nitrite tests are API Nitrate test is Salifert Nothing goes in the tank except salt water, RODI top offs and a very small amount of brine shrimp (thawed and rinsed in rodi) The tank has been running for a couple of months with no fish in it and the water has remained clear. I had both the bio wheel and the ceramic media in my sump for a few weeks before that. Ghost feeding pellets and brine failed to generate ammonia - only trace amounts of nitrates. The tank has been cycled for more than a month. I added a Bangai/Kaudern's Cardinal (Pterapogon kauderni) last friday (almost a week ago). Three days in the water was a little bit cloudy. Four days in, the water was very cloudy. To be specific, it is uniformly cloudy - I can't see what is making it that way - the particles are too fine. I've done 50% water changes both yesterday and the day before with no effect. I'm changing the filters weekly. I don't believe it's an alk problem as I'm not dosing - the only thing going in is the salt water, rodi and very small amounts of food. The only thing I could think it would be is algae suspended in the water column - but I would have expected the water change to instantly improve that. Any insights? __________________ (see blog for pics) 55g Tank (48" x 13" x 21") /c 60lbs LR & 60lbs Sand 2 MP10w 1 Koralia 425 PH, 3 Reef Brite LED Bars, 15g Sump Tunze DOC Skimmer 9002 and 2 150w Eheim Jager Heater @ 78.5 degrees

12/14/2011, 02:12 PM	#3
WetShepherd Registered Member Join Date: Jul 2011 Location: Ottawa, Canada Posts: 522 Blog Entries: 5	Thanks - I never considered using the PH like that. I have a couple of carbon pads in the HOB so maybe I can try something else on the PH like chemi-pure. __________________ (see blog for pics) 55g Tank (48" x 13" x 21") /c 60lbs LR & 60lbs Sand 2 MP10w 1 Koralia 425 PH, 3 Reef Brite LED Bars, 15g Sump Tunze DOC Skimmer 9002 and 2 150w Eheim Jager Heater @ 78.5 degrees

12/14/2011, 11:40 PM	#5
WetShepherd Registered Member Join Date: Jul 2011 Location: Ottawa, Canada Posts: 522 Blog Entries: 5	Just one cardinal, but yes, point taken. And yes, I would characterize it as white, though certainly not snow white. I've always thought the bacteria existed on surfaces (sand and rocks) - but I can see how if I removed it from the water column with a water change, that is where the algae would grow because that is where the unprocessed nutrients would be. And of course I still wouldn't be detecting ammonia/trites/trates because it's actively being used by the algae. Is that right? __________________ (see blog for pics) 55g Tank (48" x 13" x 21") /c 60lbs LR & 60lbs Sand 2 MP10w 1 Koralia 425 PH, 3 Reef Brite LED Bars, 15g Sump Tunze DOC Skimmer 9002 and 2 150w Eheim Jager Heater @ 78.5 degrees

12/15/2011, 01:24 PM	#8
stingythingy45 Registered Member Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: MA Posts: 3,296	Yup,sounds like a bacteria bloom.It can be a pain as it will get so cloudy you might not be able to monitor the fish.Water changes will only clear it for a short time and it will come right back.I knocked out a algae bloom with a U.V. sterilizer. If you can borrow one,I'd give that a try. __________________ Bob Current Tank Info: 90 gallon,mixed Reef,2-250 watt Optix 3 pendants(Phoenix 14K)2-54 watt T5 Super actnics ,ASM G-2 Gate/recirc mods,70 gal. basement sump,20L ref

Similar Threads
Thread	Thread Starter	Forum	Replies	Last Post
Diatom with cloudy water that has began to turn green	florida reef	The Reef Chemistry Forum	5	01/25/2010 08:42 AM
Cloudy qt tank	3djedi	Reef Discussion	15	01/14/2010 06:43 PM
Is cloudy water always a bacterial bloom?	snorkeler	The Reef Chemistry Forum	6	11/27/2009 09:40 PM
Brown mucus/cloudy water mystery!	ptychoptera	Reef Discussion	3	10/29/2009 05:39 AM
cloudy QT	renisel	Chicagoland Marine Aquarium Society (CMAS)	0	03/30/2008 03:56 PM

12/14/2011, 12:23 PM	#2
jon99 Registered Member Join Date: Apr 2007 Location: Atl Ga Posts: 817	I would just keep my eye on the fish and test the water regularly to make sure ammonia, nitrit, and nitrate don't spike up. You could rubber band a filter sock with some carbon in it over the end of a small power head and drop it in to see if that helps clear the water. As far as what it is... maybe just an algae bloom like you're suspecting.

12/14/2011, 05:03 PM	#4
Reefing Newbie Registered Member. Join Date: Jul 2011 Location: Minnesota Posts: 2,435	What color cloudy? If it is a whitish kind of cloudy it is probably a bacteria bloom. When you added the two cardinals you dramatically increased the bio load compared to what the frozen brine shrimp and pellets for ghost feedings were doing. If they failed to cause ammonia you probably didn't add enough food for the invisible fish. I would stop doing the WCs and wait it out because 50% changes will mean that more water needs to be populated with this bacteria. Test frequently and make sure non of the water perameters are off.

12/15/2011, 09:26 AM	#6
Reefing Newbie Registered Member. Join Date: Jul 2011 Location: Minnesota Posts: 2,435	Your algae idea is right, not an expert on that. The bacteria do eventually and are on surfaces. But when you get a bloom, the surfaces aren't large enough for all the bacteria. Eventually the balance comes in and you don't have the cloudy water. This is my theory at least. Being that it is more whatever than green, I am going to put a vote in for bacteria. Algae would mean green water I believe.