Feedback appreciated on led-setup

[Eric4]

Hi All,

After two previous tanks, and some major reconstruction on our house, time for a new setup.
The tank will be 150G (53" x 28" x 27"), total system 190G with sump.
Tank and frame are ordered, will start a build thread as soon as stuff arrives.

I browsed numerous led-threads (very, very helpful) and need your feedback before ordering the components.
I attached the picture to make things more clear.
Idea is to use Cree XP-G for the NW and CW, and XP-E for the Blue and Royal Blue's.
So two question:
- Will 100 leds be just right or overkill when running on 700mA?
- What about the "experienced color"? I like the 14K metal halide look and will rig every color with their own driver(s) to be able to tweak the color.

Thanks for your feedback, and have a great Christmas eve....

[kcress]

A hundred is a good number.

It seems like you've done your homework. That looks stellar and 14K to me.

But! What is your driver plan?

[Eric4]

Originally Posted by kcress

A hundred is a good number.

It seems like you've done your homework. That looks stellar and 14K to me.

But! What is your driver plan?

Thanks kcress, following your thread too....

Well, choosing the led's was not that difficult. The XP-G's still have the best "price/performance". Yes, the XM-L is a bit more efficient but also still more then double the price on the market. Could be countered by running them at about 1,5-2A so you need less but then you are risking spotlighting as I want to keep the fixture about 5"- 8" above the water.

Drivers.....that is still open. I haven't made up my mind and still investigating the pro's and con's of:
- Power supply and separate small drivers (i.e. Meanwell LDD-1000H, or home-build). Downside then is only PWM dimming possible.
- Standard Meanwell solution like ELN or HLN. Downside is max 12 ~ 16 led's on one driver thus needing 7 or 8 drivers....
- Going the Nuclearheli way and use something like the Thomasresearch drivers. Then only 4 needed, but need to take care of the higher voltages.

Anyway, it will be driven by a Arduino solution with 0-10V outputs (personally prefer 0-10V over PWM). Which and how is also still open (simple only for lighting, or as a part of a "full controller" like the Hydra project).

Still some thinking to do.

For the led part, you think I can get my 14K color and enough par on the bottom (27" deep) while running at the sweet spot around 700-900mA?

[Dirrk]

[QUOTE=Eric4;19665468]Thanks kcress, following your thread too....



Drivers.....that is still open. I haven't made up my mind and still investigating the pro's and con's of:
- Power supply and separate small drivers (i.e. Meanwell LDD-1000H, or home-build). Downside then is only PWM dimming possible.

seems like I read in a data sheet somewhere that PWM dimming may actually be superior in that it produces less color shift as you dim. Kcress, do I have that right? I also instinctively lean towards the simple pot control, but the color shift may be enough to change my mind. Anybody??

[Dirrk]

[QUOTE=Eric4;19665468]Thanks kcress, following your thread too....

- Standard Meanwell solution like ELN or HLN. Downside is max 12 ~ 16 led's on one driver thus needing 7 or 8 drivers....
- Going the Nuclearheli way and use something like the Thomasresearch drivers. Then only 4 needed, but need to take care of the higher voltages.

you can reduce the number of Meanwells by running parallel strings. you can run two strings of 12-14 leds on one driver that way. It's well covered in other threads. IMHO, nukes system of PLED protection makes sense for big builds. Happy New Year and keep us posted.

[00Warpig00]

You may want to take a look into inventronics drivers. they are supposed to be good drivers and have a large variety of models available to suit the needs of many LED's on a string. I am not currently using them because my kit from aquastyle came with some inexpensive drivers (maxwellen) that drive 17-19 LED's on a string per driver. But after I confirm the cheapo maxwellen drivers in my kit dont dim via controller only potentiometer I am looking at the inventronics as my alternative solution. The inventronics are a little more pricey than meanwell's tho.

Nick

[Eric4]

Hi Dirrk,

Well, thought that 0-10V (so continuous current to led) was better for lifespan then PWM (read it somewhere). However PWM saves parts on the controller side (directly from arduino).

About running parallel strings, definitely a good option providing you can realize balanced strings. In my case I should swap two Blue's for two RB's so that I can have four strings of 13.
This however rules out the ELN's, which are the only ones with a "max current trim pot" AND dimming.
With the other Meanwell series (higher power and current) it is either the trim-pot OR dimming and i need both.
I will use the "max current trim-pot" as means to set the right color at max level, subsequently the dimming inputs to create sunrise-sunset etc.
Using only PWM of 0-10V is not my first choice; when something happens to that circuit, or the connection breaks then the driver will automatically go to 100% current. I want to be in control to what that max. current will be.

Suggestions are welcome!

00Warpig00,
Looked at Inventronics, but do not offer what I need at the moment and also availability in Holland is difficult. Also dimming is limited to 0-10V and no setting of max current by means of trim-pot

Kcress; you mentioned in another thread that you should not use more then 6 Meanwell drivers in one build...... why is that?

As I see it I have the choice out of:
- 8x ELN-60-48P (or D)
- 2 "other drivers" for 4 parallel strings of RB and 2 parallel strings of CW and 2x ELN-60-40P for B and NW
- other creative driver setup??

[kcress]

[QUOTE=Dirrk;19671722]

Originally Posted by Eric4

seems like I read in a data sheet somewhere that PWM dimming may actually be superior in that it produces less color shift as you dim. Kcress, do I have that right? I also instinctively lean towards the simple pot control, but the color shift may be enough to change my mind. Anybody??

I've heard both arguments on color shift. It's a mute point with regards to our builds. You won't see it. I think you're also mixing up the fact that commercial drivers who's output is controlled thru dimming inputs have nothing to do with the current drive they're putting out to the LEDs. That color shift is a discussion only with regards to actual current in the LEDs.

[kcress]

Eric4; I can't stress enough that you should avoid high voltage drivers like they were poisonous snakes. DIY, over salt water, LED builds are the absolutely last place you would ever want to see any voltages over about 50V. Using high voltage in these builds would be reckless, foolhardy, and just plain stupid. Don't do it. It's not worth it. Do it right and safely.

Use HLG drivers and go parallel. It works fine and it's a lot safer. Parallel has been described here a bazillion times. My schematic is all over the place. If you need help finding it let us know.

[kcress]

Originally Posted by Eric4

Hi Dirrk,

Well, thought that 0-10V (so continuous current to led) was better for lifespan then PWM (read it somewhere). However PWM saves parts on the controller side (directly from arduino).

About running parallel strings, definitely a good option providing you can realize balanced strings. In my case I should swap two Blue's for two RB's so that I can have four strings of 13.
This however rules out the ELN's, which are the only ones with a "max current trim pot" AND dimming.
With the other Meanwell series (higher power and current) it is either the trim-pot OR dimming and i need both.
I will use the "max current trim-pot" as means to set the right color at max level, subsequently the dimming inputs to create sunrise-sunset etc.
Using only PWM of 0-10V is not my first choice; when something happens to that circuit, or the connection breaks then the driver will automatically go to 100% current. I want to be in control to what that max. current will be.

Suggestions are welcome!

00Warpig00,
Looked at Inventronics, but do not offer what I need at the moment and also availability in Holland is difficult. Also dimming is limited to 0-10V and no setting of max current by means of trim-pot

Kcress; you mentioned in another thread that you should not use more then 6 Meanwell drivers in one build...... why is that?

As I see it I have the choice out of:
- 8x ELN-60-48P (or D)
- 2 "other drivers" for 4 parallel strings of RB and 2 parallel strings of CW and 2x ELN-60-40P for B and NW
- other creative driver setup??

Many ELNs:
http://www.reefcentral.com/forums/sh...p#post16978586

Many of us use each ELN for two strings. It works great. That's what I'm running. That cuts the number in half. Still under 7?

You can always provide external limiting. You just run the driver dimming control with a voltage divider. You can then use a pot to set the max.

[Eric4]

Kcress, thanks for pointing the threads out.

About harmonics being fed back into the mains and all side-effects... that is one of the topics I give lectures/seminars about (working for a yellow T&M company, stuff you use I have seen ). That topic is worth a separate thread if needed, will not go into that here.

Changed my setup a bit, and think this will be a winner:
- 52 RB's in 4 strings of 13
- 12 B in one string
- 10 NW in one string
- 26 CW in two strings of 13
- 1x HLG-150H-48B for the 4 strings of RB
- 1x HLG-80H-48B for the 2 strings of CW
- 2x ELN-60-48D for both the B and NW (more cost effective than HLG-40H-48B)
- Dimming by 0-10V, indeed to be able to "set max current" by resistor divider on the dimming input. Thanks for the tip Kcress!

Any comments on the above, or better solutions? If not I will most likely order via Rapid and PowerGate

[Eric4]

Originally Posted by Eric4

Changed my setup a bit, and think this will be a winner:
- 52 RB's in 4 strings of 13
- 12 B in one string
- 10 NW in one string
- 26 CW in two strings of 13
- 1x HLG-150H-48B for the 4 strings of RB
- 1x HLG-80H-48B for the 2 strings of CW
- 2x ELN-60-48D for both the B and NW (more cost effective than HLG-40H-48B)
- Dimming by 0-10V, indeed to be able to "set max current" by resistor divider on the dimming input. Thanks for the tip Kcress!

Any comments on the above, or better solutions? If not I will most likely order via Rapid and PowerGate

Thanks for the input, the components have been ordered!
I also added 55 and 80 degree optics, now choosing the right type of aluminium profile...
When I have everything in house (and have time to work on it) I will start a new thread on this build.