Ich, I think - DT question

[Revel]

Details:
upgrade from 3yr old beautifully running 29g biocube corner bowfront recently.
Yes, 54g was properly cycled for months before making transfer.

Regal tang (she's small 3", I know she shouldn't be in a tank this size, I have every intention of giving her a new home as she begins to grow - she was a gift from my husband, he's not a reefkeeper, he thought I would like her... don't gripe at me about this, pls)
That said, she was introduced into the tank 10 days ago. Another no-no, she was not quarantined as she came directly from the personal tank of a man who literally makes his living caring for others' tanks. I should've known better...

She is rubbing on rocks today.
No other physical signs of illness.
The 29g is still running, as I am considering selling it and thought it better to keep it cycling....
I plan to isolate her into 29g (removing all rock and sand first) and use hyposalinity treatment.

My question is, if I get her out today, do you think the rest of my DT is okay?
inhabitants:

I have a pair of maroon goldbars that I've had for years. I love these little guys! (well, she's huge! 4+"!)
1- candy hogfish
1- 6 line wrasse
1- flame angel

3 maxi-mini carpets, 1 condy nem, CUC, 1 peppermint
various (hairy, rhodactis, bumpy, smooth-you name it) mushrooms, devils hands, colt, cauliflower, toadstool, chili, Paralemnalia sp trees, pulsating xenia - I think that's it

[thegrun]

I'm not sure it's ich, it could be just stress from being in a tank that is too small or any of several other diseases. I would remove the tang and get it into a bigger tank asap. Only time will tell if there will be an ich or other disease outbreak in your tank. Stress will let a disease that a fish has been successfully fighting off take hold.

[snorvich]

Originally Posted by Revel

My question is, if I get her out today, do you think the rest of my DT is okay?
inhabitants:

Your tank has ich. The inverts are fine, but the tank needs to remain fishless (fallow) for a minimum of 10 weeks. Hypo is by far the most difficult of the three accepted treatments.

[MrTuskfish]

Originally Posted by snorvich

Your tank has ich. The inverts are fine, but the tank needs to remain fishless (fallow) for a minimum of 10 weeks. Hypo is by far the most difficult of the three accepted treatments.

+1.The new tang and the scratching are almost sure things for ich. A 3'' regal isn't going to be hurt by a couple of months in a QT. these are hardy fish and he'll need a new home. but he's fine for now. Stress from lack of room is a long-term concern; not an overnight death sentence. But find him a better home after you've treated him.

[Revel]

Oh wow. I was afraid of this.
Okay.
Off to clean out the 29 to create a hospital tank.

Ya'll pray for my sanity and their stress while I try to catch these guys in the DT

[stingythingy45]

I hope you have a refractor.
You'll have to take the salinity down to 1.008 s.g. over about 3 days time.
Do a search for Steven Pro and cryptocaryon.

[KatilicaClavijo]

I wouldn't get rid of the 29g, if you have space save it for a QT for the future. Im sure your tank has ICH already, try to leave your tank fishless for 9 weeks to be safe..same happen to me... didn't want to Quarantine... just quarantine one of the fishes and it was worthless the ICH was already in the tank and I lost all of the rest , . Try to quarantine.

[Andrew]

To Reef Central

Cryptocaryon irritans causes all kinds of headaches and stress for many saltwater fish owners. It's a problem and it's best to just assume that every fish you purchase will carry the parasite. Regal tang are very prone to ich and often introduce it into home aquariums. I'm providing a link to a Reef Keeping magazine article I would stronly recommend reading up on by Steven Pro:

http://reefkeeping.com/issues/2003-08/sp/index.php

http://reefkeeping.com/issues/2003-1...ture/index.php

[MrTuskfish]

Originally Posted by mobyich

I used kickich and had good success with it.

I suspect your success is temporary and ich will be back. This product sa's its 'reef-safe and there is no med, that we know of, that will kill ich and not coral and other inverts.

[sponger0]

Originally Posted by mobyich

I used kickich and had good success with it.

This product is useless. No such thing as a reef safe ich treatment. Go with one of the 2 recommended treatments

Originally Posted by snorvich

Your tank has ich. The inverts are fine, but the tank needs to remain fishless (fallow) for a minimum of 10 weeks. Hypo is by far the most difficult of the three accepted treatments.

10 weeks is a bit excessive. 6 weeks min and 8 weeks max and you should be good.

Originally Posted by stingythingy45

I hope you have a refractor.
You'll have to take the salinity down to 1.008 s.g. over about 3 days time.
Do a search for Steven Pro and cryptocaryon.

This is if you go the hypo method.

You can go copper but check info on your fish and how well it handles copper treatment. Some fish dont do well with copper so you may have to go hypo.

[sponger0]

Actually, now that I look at the type of fish, you may want to consider treating it and finding it a new home. A regal tank needs a large tank and a 29 gallon isnt goin to work. Needs 100 gallon + tank. 29 gallons isnt going to cut it.

[MrTuskfish]

Originally Posted by sponger0

Actually, now that I look at the type of fish, you may want to consider treating it and finding it a new home. A regal tank needs a large tank and a 29 gallon isnt goin to work. Needs 100 gallon + tank. 29 gallons isnt going to cut it.

The 29 is a HT. The tang is 3". it will be fine for the quarantine period. then, it should find a new home. Also; I also think 10-12 weeks fallow gives the best odds of killing all ich (nothing is pure 100%) in the DT. Snorvich does a great job of showing this in his sticky. More and more folks are finding out that all ich parasites don't follow the rules.(http://www.reefcentral.com/forums/sh....php?t=2041951)

[sponger0]

Originally Posted by MrTuskfish

The 29 is a HT. The tang is 3". it will be fine for the quarantine period. then, it should find a new home. Also; I also think 10-12 weeks fallow gives the best odds of killing all ich (nothing is pure 100%) in the DT. Snorvich does a great job of showing this in his sticky. More and more folks are finding out that all ich parasites don't follow the rules.(http://www.reefcentral.com/forums/sh....php?t=2041951)

Ok misread on the DT. But the DT is only 54 gallons. You still ok with that?

And on your other comment on the 10-12 weeks. Some people are a bit excessive.

[MrTuskfish]

Originally Posted by sponger0

Ok misread on the DT. But the DT is only 54 gallons. You still ok with that?

And on your other comment on the 10-12 weeks. Some people are a bit excessive.

Please re-read my posts. I've said , twice, that the tang should find a new home after treatment.

According to published research, that Snorvich compiled in the sticky, 6 weeks fallow will get rid of ich 95% of the time, 9 weeks will do it 99.7% of the time. I don't consider 10-12 weeks excessive at all. Six weeks fallow will result in ich surviving 5% of the time, in other words, it eradication will fail for 1 in 20 hobbyists who go just 6 weeks. Are you OK with that?

[Revel]

So far, all is going well.
after 4 days of slowly de-salting the water, I've got the hospital tank to proper hyposalinity of 12ppt/1.009.
I'm a stay-at-home mom, homeschooling our brood of children, so I'm able to keep a pretty steady eye on the tank for monitoring.

Fish don't seem overly excited about being in a bare 29g, but no picking or fighting, either.

There are several PVC elbows and funky shaped connectors and pipes for hiding and swimming through. Doing a daily baster sucking of the tank floor to keep it super clean.

Considering a UV sterilizer, just as an added step. Overkill? or good idea?

Thank you all for the knowledge you so freely share here, on RC!

[Revel]

No thoughts on the UV?

Also, when it rains....

Today, doing the water testing & such for my 3g (fishless) desktop, I see flatworms on the glass.
Just GRRRRR.

Haven't researched yet, thought I'd try for a quick yes/no answer:
pico inhabitants are a few snails, teeny hermits, porcelain crab, peppermint shrimp.

My question: Can I put an arrowhead in there for de-flatworming (and will then move him to my 54g) or is arrowhead + peppermint a bad idea?

[Revel]

Forgot to update.

All fish in hospital 29g doing well. Swimming actively, no picking, eating well.
Regal is still the only fish to show signs of ich.

But in my DT, little teeny tiny white bugs moving around on the glass. I'm guessing these are the little nasties looking for a host. I have foul foul words for this, but will keep that to myself ;-P

[snorvich]

Originally Posted by Revel

Forgot to update.

All fish in hospital 29g doing well. Swimming actively, no picking, eating well.
Regal is still the only fish to show signs of ich.

But in my DT, little teeny tiny white bugs moving around on the glass. I'm guessing these are the little nasties looking for a host. I have foul foul words for this, but will keep that to myself ;-P

No, those are most likely not nasties unless you have microscopic eyes. UV will do nothing for you in a single tank environment as it is not possible to get a 100% of the water through the UV. If you are doing hypo, be sure you are using a calibrated refractometer. Hypo is the most difficult of all of the accepted treatments for ich as it is so easy to increase SG due to evaporation top off.

[Revel]

Originally Posted by snorvich

No, those are most likely not nasties unless you have microscopic eyes. UV will do nothing for you in a single tank environment as it is not possible to get a 100% of the water through the UV. If you are doing hypo, be sure you are using a calibrated refractometer. Hypo is the most difficult of all of the accepted treatments for ich as it is so easy to increase SG due to evaporation top off.

Not the little buggers? hmmm could've sworn I read that they'd be visible on glass & in column when a batch hatched & was in search for a host. Ok.
Will have one of the kidlets research these buggies, then.
Thanks for the answer on the UV.

Yes, a calibrated refractometer. I chose hypo b/c I read multiple times that regals can be sensitive to copper. Because I am at home, evaporation/top off is not much of an issue. I test the water multiple times a day and have proper water level marked on the tank for a quick visual, a reminder set in my phone, etc ...

I never really wanted a regal, but I'm going to do everything I can to keep her from suffering and cure her.
After danger has passed, I think I am going to give her to my church. There is a 3,000g in the children's wing (built by the guys from "Tanked"). Looked last Sunday, there is not already a regal in the tank. She will be happy there.

[Revel]

Well, after all this time of everything going great, there was a sudden spike in nitrate in the hospital tank.
We lost the regal, flame and wrasse.

Huge amounts of water changing, the candy and my 2 goldbars seem to be doing fine.