Seahorse tank build from the beginning starting with

[JenC2012]

This is my first build so I have itemized my equipment and costs. I will post pictures and updates on the project from start to finish. Now, I have a plan on how to put it all together, but I need some help figuring out plumbing. I have a 55g acrylic hex tank: 30" across 24" tall, approx 5' return from sump (purposing a split in return and plan on using tubing).

I am setting the tank up to house seahorses so the return flow will be the only water movement in the tank. I am drilling it for a 1-2 inch overlow (depending on what I find out here) that I will fit with a diy durso standpipe. I will then use the created overflow space (approx 15g) for a refugium to establish large copepod population and grow edible macros for my other tank.

My question is on the return: could I drill for two return bulkheads 3/4" or larger? The plan is to have locline on one side possibly split so I could have concentrated flow in two areas and a diy rainbar on the other.

I plan on purchasing a 1300gph return pump, will this be sufficient/too much/not enough?

I would really appreciate any input you have. This is my first build, wish me luck!

Thank you so much for your insight!

Setup/Cost:
55g Tank and stand:$75
10g sump w/scrap acrylic dividers: $10
50 lbs live rock (CraigsList): $60
Tank Refinishing (Sandpaper + black stain): $20
24" Coralife T5 combo reef light (CL): $50
DIY Overflow box: $81
Plumbing: $30-$50
Return pump: $70-$120
100w heater: $18
50w backup heater: $10
7w UV Sterilizer: $45
JBJ Auto Top-off: $79
Octopus 110 Protein Skimmer: $180
GFCI: $18
Misc. filter/feed: $80

Macro:
Blue Octode: $20
Dragons Breath: $8
Blue Scroll: $7
Red Titan: $7
Halimeda: $5
Calurepa Mexican: $4
*MORE TO COME

Coral:
Orange zoa
*Purple Gorgonian
*Red + Golden Mushroom

[JenC2012]

I plan on stocking with seahorses from Ocean rider since they are trained to eat frozen food from a feeding station. I wont stock the tank until my macros have grown in and my pod population has grown, I'm thinking 6-9 months down the road.
Stocking Plan:
2-4 Seahorses leaning toward the starburst
2-3 lettuce slugs
10-20 bumble bee snails
1-2 pom pom crabs (I think these guys are really cute but I've read mixed reviews on keeping them with seahorses) Has anyone kept these together successfully?

I'm trying to post pictures but can't figure it out. Can someone help?

[fishgate]

I was looking into Seahorses as well. My issue is I cannot currently get any of my SW tanks below 80. 80 is too high for seahorses. I would need a chiller which is around $400. Have you looked at temp issues?

[timinnl]

You are better off buying your seahorses from seahorsesource in FL. Sunburst is just a marketing name for H. erectus and you are paying based on color, something that disappointed a lot of people before you. If you go into the seahorse forum on here, ask for feedback about buying base on color.

Your build looks good.

Kind Regards,

Tim

[SUPPOReefer]

Erectus are going to change color based on their mood. Definitely need a chiller. My wife had a 65 gallon seahorse tank. We ran a 1/3rd HP chiller to keep it at 71 degrees with a .2 degree variance.
What the pump is rated for at 0' head is not important. What does it put out at 5'? Turnover isn't as bad as directional flow. You want as many returns as possible or returns that do a good job of spreading the flow out as opposed to direction high velocity returns. My wife ran a mag 7.5 at 5' head dialed half back with a ball valve split into four returns.
Stay away from any crabs. They are opportunistic eaters. Seahorses are very slow. I had a 1/2" blue leg hermit attack a seahorse before.

[JenC2012]

I live in Washington state where the temperature high in summer is around 78, in the winter the house is kept at 70.
I am currently heating with 2 -50w cheapie heaters and it's been keeping the tank at a constant 74-76 degrees, once I get the sump installed I will purchase a more reliable tunable heater and have one 50w cheapie in as backup.

I can understand needing a chiller in the summer, but do you think I will need one now?

I do know that Oceanrider sells by color and that's the way they market, but I wanted very healthy feeding station trained seahorses. Also, it's a shorter journey for them to come in from Hawaii instead of crossing the continent, but I will check out seahorse source to see if there stock is the same quality.

[JenC2012]

Originally Posted by SUPPOReefer

Erectus are going to change color based on their mood. Definitely need a chiller. My wife had a 65 gallon seahorse tank. We ran a 1/3rd HP chiller to keep it at 71 degrees with a .2 degree variance.
What the pump is rated for at 0' head is not important. What does it put out at 5'? Turnover isn't as bad as directional flow. You want as many returns as possible or returns that do a good job of spreading the flow out as opposed to direction high velocity returns. My wife ran a mag 7.5 at 5' head dialed half back with a ball valve split into four returns.
Stay away from any crabs. They are opportunistic eaters. Seahorses are very slow. I had a 1/2" blue leg hermit attack a seahorse before.

I was told seahorses needed the volume turned over 5x/hr (300 gph), I plan on plumbing two returns, I don't think flow will be a problem since I will be making my own rainbars out of pvc. I will have one return be an actual rainbar to break the water surface and one side will be a spray bar that will go straight down the tank and do a 90 degree angle with a diffusion at the tip. I will be drilling the holes so I can adjust the flow rate easily, but I won't know for sure what my output will be.

Did you plumb with PVC or tubing? I know PVC slows the rate of return as well as any split you put in. If you ran a mag 7 on a 65g than my plan of having a mag 12 on a 55g may be a bit excessive, I was worried about stagnation since I WILL NOT put a powerhead in with the seahorses.

[JenC2012]

I've been milling over equipment for the tank and was wondering if I could get some opinions. My original plan was to get a cheap uv sterilizer, but then realized the cost of maintaining it over the 3 years a good UV sterilizer would have been paid for, so my original sump would have been sectioned 3 times. 1 protein skimmer, over through filter floss into 2nd compartment containing bioballs, chemical filter, and pump for UV, then the 3rd section is where the uv would spill out and return pump would be. Also after learning of SUPPOReefs return pump size I decided my plan was overkill so the above plan equipment cost:

mag 7 $70
Good UV sterillizer $114
pump for uv sterilizer $30

Now the alternative I have come up with is to split sump into 2, one side for protein skimmer and canister filter pump which would double as return pump. The other side would be a refugium/grow out tank for babies. This would allow me to balance ph at night among other things. Theres a canister filter on Ebay and it says it's rated for 525 gph, since that is 10x the volume of the tank I would think that with head loss it might be close to the 300 gph needed.

Canister filter w/UV $100

I would save $114 going the canister filter route and I would have extra space in the sump, but I don't know if it's powerful enough to make up for head loss.

Any opinions?

[timinnl]

Originally Posted by JenC2012

I was told seahorses needed the volume turned over 5x/hr (300 gph), I plan on plumbing two returns, I don't think flow will be a problem since I will be making my own rainbars out of pvc. I will have one return be an actual rainbar to break the water surface and one side will be a spray bar that will go straight down the tank and do a 90 degree angle with a diffusion at the tip. I will be drilling the holes so I can adjust the flow rate easily, but I won't know for sure what my output will be.

Did you plumb with PVC or tubing? I know PVC slows the rate of return as well as any split you put in. If you ran a mag 7 on a 65g than my plan of having a mag 12 on a 55g may be a bit excessive, I was worried about stagnation since I WILL NOT put a powerhead in with the seahorses.

They do much better if you have a turnover rate of 10 to 15 times per hour as long as you give them areas of low, med & high flow areas. Loclines works well if you hook them to the output.

Kind Regards,

Tim

[timinnl]

Ask to have this thread moved into the seahorse section. You should get a boarder feedback into your plans.

Kind Regards,

Tim

[JenC2012]

I just purchased the return pump and went with the mag 9.5, since it was on sale at Amazon for $88 w/pre filter; and it was middle of the road between the 7 and 12 I had been considering.

[Shallow]

A canister filter isn't at all ideal for this situation. Seahorses are a little finicky regarding water quality, and canisters just catch the crud, so if you don't clean it out all the time it rots and will ruin your water. Couple that with the fact that seahorses are messy eaters (don't catch food well) and also leave alot of mess behind (don't digest food great) and there will be a quick buildup of nitrites or starving seahorses.So your going to have to clean the canister out all the time which is a trial, or your seahorses will die, and you will wish you had spent a little extra and got a good skimmer.
I see your going to buy an ato, if so then you can just ad some fans to keep the temp down, just make sure to keep the freshwater reservoir topped up as the evaporation really turns up a notch with the fan on. Save the chiller money and put it on a better skimmer

[Shallow]

I would get a stronger pump than you need that is adjustable (eheim compact or some of the eden or tunze silence) you can get the flow right without having to waste your money trialling different powerheads.
Also if you could though a wider overflow would be better, perhaps coast to coast, with so much flow going over in one spot it might cause the seahorses to get sucked over or stuck on the mesh you put there.
Look forward to seeing the tank, seahorse are weirdly awesome.

[rlpardue]

Hi, I'll be following this thread in the future; it sounds interesting! I currently have a 30g seahorse tank with a 30g sump/refugium, and I enjoy plumbing so I'll throw in my two cents:

1- Your Mag 9.5 is fine; it won't be too much flow. I have around 800-900 gph in my 30g tank. Your idea for splitting it up into multiple return outlets is a good idea! It solves the dead-spot problem without using seahorse-tail-eating powerheads.
2-If the cost isn't too much of a problem (or space), go with as big a sump/refugium as you can. It can provide lots of microfauna, increase water volume (and thereby decrease pollution), give you more breathing space b/t water changes and lets you use a sock filter/trickle filter and refugium. (I built my own sump and it has all three)
3-Chiller - I don't imagine you'll need one. Since I live in Texas and have a flat-rate electric bill (b/c part of a condo complex), I run my a/c low enough so that the tank stays between 72-75 year round. In WA you shouldn't have problems keeping the tank cool. I suggest using a small fan on the sump to increase evaporation and thus cool the water temp.
4-Hobbyists' recommendations on seahorse vendor always point towards Seahorsesource.com. I think FL is still closer to you than Hawaii, and the feeding station point isn't really as significant as you may think. Regardless of where/how you feed them, they will learn (rapidly) to get with the program. I like using 12-inch tongs to feed individual mysis to my ponies; it gives me a little more control over nutrients, but takes more time.

[JenC2012]

Originally Posted by Shallow

A canister filter isn't at all ideal for this situation. Seahorses are a little finicky regarding water quality, and canisters just catch the crud, so if you don't clean it out all the time it rots and will ruin your water. Couple that with the fact that seahorses are messy eaters (don't catch food well) and also leave alot of mess behind (don't digest food great) and there will be a quick buildup of nitrites or starving seahorses.So your going to have to clean the canister out all the time which is a trial, or your seahorses will die, and you will wish you had spent a little extra and got a good skimmer.
I see your going to buy an ato, if so then you can just ad some fans to keep the temp down, just make sure to keep the freshwater reservoir topped up as the evaporation really turns up a notch with the fan on. Save the chiller money and put it on a better skimmer

The idea was to have the sump with protein (octopus skimmer retails for $180 best skimmer I would think available for a small system) and then in lue of having the next step be a trickle filter in the sump I would have had the canister pump up the skimmed water and pump it back into the main tank.

[JenC2012]

I recieved the black acrylic panel that I will use for the overflow today! I'm getting very close to drilling the tank! I should have everything I need to plumb it by Thursday.
Today I bought a cascade 100w heater for $13 and I purchased $50 worth of locline from an Ebay seller after I tried 2 large hardware stores that had no idea what locline was.

I still need the pipe and connections to go from bulkhead to pump. My pump will arrive on Wednesday, I will take that and the bulkheads with me to get the right connection.

Can anyone tell me how to drill a hole for a bulkhead in an acrylic tank? Do I need a special tool? Also I'd like to cut part of the top cover off, to make the overflow more accessable, has anyone ever widened the opening of there tank? I would love to hear your thoughts.

[NanoReefWanabe]

i would just like to say that with approximately 600GPH going through that tank with the mag9 it is going to be excruciatingly loud...you will be far better off plumbing for a herbie drain or even better a bean drain...you will then be able to use the full potential of the pump without the noise of a durso drain (i still dont understand why people nowadays still want to use a durso)

also wondering what you mean by rain bar? do you plan on having half of the return above the surface of the water and fall into the tank? that is also going to be loud and very messy, contributing to a lot of salt creep issues around the top of the tank and on the lights...i would just keep the returns as spray bars and have every third hole or so drilled in the top to shoot the water up at the surface...

why cant you drill for a closed loop system as well...they are 100X more efficient then relying on your return pump for total in tank flow...you are going to end up with dead spots in a 24" tall tank, 600gph, and only using spray bars (which create a painfully high amount of back pressure/ head loss) drill the intake of the CL to draw from inside the overflow box (that way there is no suction areas in the tank for ponies to get stuck on) and then you can drill 2 or three returns in the bottom of the tank, and use lockline to direct the flow around the whole bottom of the tank and force all the poop etc to the surface..and then also use a spray bar accross the top too...but you can use a much smaller more efficient pump for the return (and introduce a lot less heat into your tank, those mag 9's run hot, when i was using one on my 20G tank i didnt need a heater at all)

if you drilled for a closed loop you could also just have a single return in the bottom of the tank and also use a spray bar the goes all the way around the bottom of the tank...just an idea..not sure how you could hide it in the sand though... i guess it depends on the theme of your tank..you could make it look like a white picket fence, holding back your ponies...lol or paint it brown to look like a cedar rail fence....

[NanoReefWanabe]

Originally Posted by JenC2012

I recieved the black acrylic panel that I will use for the overflow today! I'm getting very close to drilling the tank! I should have everything I need to plumb it by Thursday.
Today I bought a cascade 100w heater for $13 and I purchased $50 worth of locline from an Ebay seller after I tried 2 large hardware stores that had no idea what locline was.

I still need the pipe and connections to go from bulkhead to pump. My pump will arrive on Wednesday, I will take that and the bulkheads with me to get the right connection.

Can anyone tell me how to drill a hole for a bulkhead in an acrylic tank? Do I need a special tool? Also I'd like to cut part of the top cover off, to make the overflow more accessable, has anyone ever widened the opening of there tank? I would love to hear your thoughts.

depends on your bulkheads, assuming they are slip you need straight pipe...your pump will need a female insert adapter...one side threaded one side slip...you will also want a single union ball valve above your pump, they can be slip or threaded...the valve is to control the water flow, the union is for maintenance removal of the pump...kill two birds with one stone and use a single union ball valve as opposed to a union and a ball valve...

as for drilling in acrylic you need a cordless drill with adjustable clutch, and a hole saw for drilling wood/bimetal...same as drilling glass i would use water to keep the acrylic cool to avoid stress cracks and crazing issues...as for the braces on top we would need to see a picture of the top of the tank to say for sure...

as for posting pictures: get a photobucket account (they are free) UL your pics to photobucket, then hover over the IMG tags link it should flash copied if not you can left click on the image tag and it will copy the link...then you come here and simply paste it into the body of the thread or your can click the little insert image icon (yellow with a mountain) and voila pics will appear.

[Shallow]

Yep that's a good skimmer, but even so having the canister after the skimmer it will still fill with detritus, skimmers only remove about 30% to my understanding. My sump is after my skimmer and the filth there is testament to it.
I'm not sure of the type of plastic used on your tank but some seem quite brittle, I would worry that it would crack with sawing, but I haven't tried personally.
Save the canister for blowing off the crud of the rocks/substrate whenever you can be bothered, this way it will remove organics without polluting your water.
O and you want to use some soft tubing for part of the run back from the pump, it will silent vibration and is easy to setup, just remember plastic hose clamps.

[JenC2012]

I dropped the tank off at a plastics shop, it is being drilled for four returns and the drain. They said it would be two hours of work totaling $120.
I also purchased a lot of loc-line. The loc-line spray bar, some Y splitters and various end pieces for different flow patterns. In total I will have (4) 1/2" water flow streams w/variety of tips, (1) 1/2" loc-line spray bar for dead spots, (1) 3/4" line with large flat nozzle that will point toward the surface water to agitate. In total I spent about $130 in loc-line.
This is turning out to be way more expensive than I thought it would be...

[JenC2012]

Hi all! I'm so glad so many people are contributing to this thread, I love reading about your systems and hearing your comments. I'm trying to get this thread moved to the seahorse forum for more input.

I'm wondering what would be best for my system, fake hitching posts or real gorgonians. Do you think with the mag 9.5 pump with the 4 loc-line outputs (2-cone, 1-flat, 1-5 hole-opening)and one 24" loc-line spray bar will be enough flow to maintain a couple gorgonians? Do you think water quality will be an issue with this sort of filter feeder? Should I stick with fake or try the real thing, I don't mind target feeding if it's once or twice a week.

Thanks for your input!

[JenC2012]

So today I did my first test of the plumbing. It leaks around a couple of joints and i'm not sure if I can fix it because they're barb/hose joints and i'm not sure if teflon tape would stay in place or plumbers putty. I think I may need to use PVC, which is kinda' lame because there are so many returns and the return pump is far from the returns.

I did not put the overflow panel in yet. I wanted to test the connections without a barrier, so I could fiddle with the pipes if something was wrong. I need to change the design of the overflow as well; since the opening of my tank does not permit a one sided box. So I am putting in a 3 sided overflow instead.

I'm going to try and post some pictures of what I have done so far.

[JenC2012]

[JenC2012]

http://pinterest.com/mrsclancy24/jen-s-seahorse-tank/