Multiple Dwarf Angels?

PatrickFul10 · 07/18/2013, 06:27 PM

Hello, I've read that you shouldn't keep 2 dwarf angels in the same tank. I've also read that if you add them both at the same time, they will be ok.
Obviously you can add multiple if you have a 200 gallon tank, but mine is only a 55. I was wondering if people have any experience or opinions about this.
thanks

RayL · 07/18/2013, 06:57 PM

IMO one should be in there, no more then that

Alberta-newb · 07/18/2013, 08:45 PM

I agree a 55 is probably to small for two. That being said, I currently have a flame and coral beauty in a 75 gallon cube. The coral beauty has been in there about 5 years and the flame was added about a year ago as a smaller fish.

The coral beauty is second in command ( a falco hawkish is boss). Aggression was about a day of chasing, they've gotten along fine since.

One thing with this tank is it has a fairly complex aqua scape with plenty of tunnels and escape routes around the live rock allowing the flame to keep out of the cb's way.

I probably got lucky this time and won't ever try it again in a tank this small. (That's why I'm upgrading to a 10 footer). ;-)

Francis

Alberta-newb · 07/18/2013, 09:04 PM

I should also add, whenever adding multiple angels together, make sure you have a "plan B", whether an arrangement to return the fish or somewhere else it can go if hostility is too much (i.e. a separate tank already running or a friend with room). I recently purchased a blue girdled angel that was being kept in a fuge because of aggression. A sad place to keep such a wonderful fish.

beachbreak · 07/18/2013, 09:06 PM

Ive got a flame and a potters in a 180. They chase and hassle each other pretty regularly but nothing serious. I doubt i would try it in a 55...thats perfect for one angel but to small for two.

o2manyfish · 07/18/2013, 09:41 PM

400g

Flame,
Multicolor
Flameback (2)
Golden (2)
Mutli-Bar (2)

Trio of Belus

Everyone gets along and the Belus spawn pretty regularly.

Dave B

Toddrtrex · 07/18/2013, 10:05 PM

In the past my 58 had a multicolor, coral beauty and venustus for about a year.

After I moved (( just over 2 years ago )), I went with a 65, it now has the multicolored and coral. After about 2 months I moved my flame (( used to a pair, lost the smallest one in the move )) into that tank. They have been together for 2 years now.

The venustus is now in a 40 breeder, as the only dwarf, a bit too shy to be with other dwarfs in a smallish tank.

The current 65

The old 58

johnike · 07/19/2013, 04:38 AM

Hello Todd, good to see you.
I had to drain my 240 to get mine out, I had 4 and the experiment failed miserably. Others, like Todd and Dave have had great luck.
It's a crapshoot.

Toddrtrex · 07/19/2013, 11:48 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by johnike

Hello Todd, good to see you.
I had to drain my 240 to get mine out, I had 4 and the experiment failed miserably. Others, like Todd and Dave have had great luck.
It's a crapshoot.

Howdy John.

That sounds like it would be a pain.

I did try a golden dwarf and a potter's in the 58 --- that was a mess. Removing a dwarf from a fully stocked SPS tank is a PITA, so to the OP, be prepared to intervene if you have to -- if you aren't willing to take apart your tank, don't attempt.

MrTuskfish · 07/19/2013, 11:52 AM

There isn't any real answer for questions like this, IMO & IME., just shared experience and common sense. The common sense comes in when you add a DA to a tank with another DA and the fish is established and very territorial. This question comes up a lot and I think the only real reply is :the bigger the tank, the better the chances. I've kept 4 DAs in a 55 (years ago) with no problem. I've also had a 240 that failed with several combinations of just 2. I do think there is too much hype against it working, but always have a plan B. If you try to add one to an established tankmate: after the new fish has finished in QT, add him and put the established fish in the QT for a week or so. I think taking the territorial edge away greatly improves chances.

Toddrtrex · 07/19/2013, 11:55 AM

To add;

Would never attempt without using an acclimation box, to see how the (( if there is one )) existing dwarf angel(s) react --- I have left them in the box for up to a week.

Can see the box on the left side of the tank,

humaguy · 07/19/2013, 12:05 PM

yeah, tough call and can go either way...but worth a try as long as you have a plan b...

humaguy · 07/19/2013, 12:08 PM

lol, but don't forget there was a time we didn't have acclimation/isolation boxes...rearranging the rock, lights off, and observation ruled the day...

o2manyfish · 07/19/2013, 12:22 PM

Before my 400g I had a 125 for over a decade.

I kept flames, goldens, cherubs and flamebacks in it regularly. There were occassional multi-color and Venustus.

I have always kept lots of rock in my tanks. My 125 was a 24" tall tank and the rock went from bottom to top, So there was lots of hiding spaces for the little angels.

When I added the flamebacks to my 400g I bought one for myself and one for a friend. I put the second fish in the acclimation box till my friend could pick it up. Once the fish went into the box, the original flameback didn't leave the side of the acclimation box. After 5 days of the two fish sitting side by side (one in the box and one in the tank) I let my friend know he would have to wait for a flameback and released him into the tank.

Dave B

RayL · 07/19/2013, 01:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by o2manyfish

Before my 400g I had a 125 for over a decade.

I kept flames, goldens, cherubs and flamebacks in it regularly. There were occassional multi-color and Venustus.

I have always kept lots of rock in my tanks. My 125 was a 24" tall tank and the rock went from bottom to top, So there was lots of hiding spaces for the little angels.

When I added the flamebacks to my 400g I bought one for myself and one for a friend. I put the second fish in the acclimation box till my friend could pick it up. Once the fish went into the box, the original flameback didn't leave the side of the acclimation box. After 5 days of the two fish sitting side by side (one in the box and one in the tank) I let my friend know he would have to wait for a flameback and released him into the tank.

Dave B

What a great story, good decision

Sheol · 07/19/2013, 05:42 PM

Currently, I still have my C. bicolor & my African Flameback in the 60 gallon mushroom/softy Reef.
There were fireworks the first week the C. acanthops ( I think that is the right binomial but could be wrong, going on my now Over the Hill Memory here!) was in there. The Bicolor had had free run of the tank & was more than twice the size of the AFB. However, things turned around. Actually, kind of glad that thing is not bigger!
Detente has since been reached.

Sincerely,
Matthew

PatrickFul10 · 07/20/2013, 02:57 PM

thanks to everyone for all the good stories and tips. i may attempt it with an acclimation box. i do in fact have a plan b. i have a reef tank upstairs i could put one in.

humaguy · 07/20/2013, 03:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by PatrickFul10

thanks to everyone for all the good stories and tips. i may attempt it with an acclimation box. i do in fact have a plan b. i have a reef tank upstairs i could put one in.

excellent, just bear in mind some centropyge are pitas in reefs...

07/18/2013, 06:27 PM	#1
PatrickFul10 Registered Member Join Date: Jul 2013 Location: Louisville, KY Posts: 14	Multiple Dwarf Angels? Hello, I've read that you shouldn't keep 2 dwarf angels in the same tank. I've also read that if you add them both at the same time, they will be ok. Obviously you can add multiple if you have a 200 gallon tank, but mine is only a 55. I was wondering if people have any experience or opinions about this. thanks

07/18/2013, 09:41 PM	#6
o2manyfish Registered Member Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: Encino, CA Posts: 6,199	400g Flame, Multicolor Flameback (2) Golden (2) Mutli-Bar (2) Trio of Belus Everyone gets along and the Belus spawn pretty regularly. Dave B __________________ 560g Display. 1500g System Volume. (2) 180g Outdoor Frag Tanks. 340g Sump, 30g 2 story surge tank. Dasatco EXT 9. Bubble King Skimmer. Ozone. UV. 5' Fluidized Sand Filter. Avast Kalk Mixer. Current Tank Info: 560g SPS Dominant Reef / 1500g Total System

07/18/2013, 10:05 PM	#7
Toddrtrex Registered Member Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: Carol Stream, IL Posts: 23,162	In the past my 58 had a multicolor, coral beauty and venustus for about a year. After I moved (( just over 2 years ago )), I went with a 65, it now has the multicolored and coral. After about 2 months I moved my flame (( used to a pair, lost the smallest one in the move )) into that tank. They have been together for 2 years now. The venustus is now in a 40 breeder, as the only dwarf, a bit too shy to be with other dwarfs in a smallish tank. The current 65 The old 58 __________________ Click my name and then "visit toddrtrex's homepage" for tank pictures Current Tank Info: 210g reef and 65g reef

07/19/2013, 11:52 AM	#10
MrTuskfish Registered Member Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: The Wild Blue Yonder Posts: 8,887	There isn't any real answer for questions like this, IMO & IME., just shared experience and common sense. The common sense comes in when you add a DA to a tank with another DA and the fish is established and very territorial. This question comes up a lot and I think the only real reply is :the bigger the tank, the better the chances. I've kept 4 DAs in a 55 (years ago) with no problem. I've also had a 240 that failed with several combinations of just 2. I do think there is too much hype against it working, but always have a plan B. If you try to add one to an established tankmate: after the new fish has finished in QT, add him and put the established fish in the QT for a week or so. I think taking the territorial edge away greatly improves chances. __________________ If God didn't want us to eat animals, he wouldn't have made them out of meat. Steve Current Tank Info: 180, 2-240 FOWLRs, 240 reef

07/19/2013, 11:55 AM	#11
Toddrtrex Registered Member Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: Carol Stream, IL Posts: 23,162	To add; Would never attempt without using an acclimation box, to see how the (( if there is one )) existing dwarf angel(s) react --- I have left them in the box for up to a week. Can see the box on the left side of the tank, __________________ Click my name and then "visit toddrtrex's homepage" for tank pictures Current Tank Info: 210g reef and 65g reef

07/18/2013, 06:57 PM	#2
RayL Registered Member Join Date: Jan 2013 Location: Canada Posts: 1,267	IMO one should be in there, no more then that

07/18/2013, 08:45 PM	#3
Alberta-newb Registered Member Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: Alberta, Canada Posts: 246	I agree a 55 is probably to small for two. That being said, I currently have a flame and coral beauty in a 75 gallon cube. The coral beauty has been in there about 5 years and the flame was added about a year ago as a smaller fish. The coral beauty is second in command ( a falco hawkish is boss). Aggression was about a day of chasing, they've gotten along fine since. One thing with this tank is it has a fairly complex aqua scape with plenty of tunnels and escape routes around the live rock allowing the flame to keep out of the cb's way. I probably got lucky this time and won't ever try it again in a tank this small. (That's why I'm upgrading to a 10 footer). ;-) Francis

07/18/2013, 09:04 PM	#4
Alberta-newb Registered Member Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: Alberta, Canada Posts: 246	I should also add, whenever adding multiple angels together, make sure you have a "plan B", whether an arrangement to return the fish or somewhere else it can go if hostility is too much (i.e. a separate tank already running or a friend with room). I recently purchased a blue girdled angel that was being kept in a fuge because of aggression. A sad place to keep such a wonderful fish.

07/18/2013, 09:06 PM	#5
beachbreak Registered Member Join Date: Oct 2007 Location: TX Posts: 284	Ive got a flame and a potters in a 180. They chase and hassle each other pretty regularly but nothing serious. I doubt i would try it in a 55...thats perfect for one angel but to small for two.

07/19/2013, 04:38 AM	#8
johnike Moved On Join Date: Oct 2004 Location: Bureau County Illinois Posts: 5,406	Hello Todd, good to see you. I had to drain my 240 to get mine out, I had 4 and the experiment failed miserably. Others, like Todd and Dave have had great luck. It's a crapshoot.

07/19/2013, 12:05 PM	#12
humaguy Premium Member Join Date: Dec 2006 Location: Western Ct, NYC Posts: 8,218	yeah, tough call and can go either way...but worth a try as long as you have a plan b...

07/19/2013, 12:08 PM	#13
humaguy Premium Member Join Date: Dec 2006 Location: Western Ct, NYC Posts: 8,218	lol, but don't forget there was a time we didn't have acclimation/isolation boxes...rearranging the rock, lights off, and observation ruled the day... Last edited by humaguy; 07/19/2013 at 12:25 PM. Reason: ommision

07/19/2013, 12:22 PM	#14
o2manyfish Registered Member Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: Encino, CA Posts: 6,199	Before my 400g I had a 125 for over a decade. I kept flames, goldens, cherubs and flamebacks in it regularly. There were occassional multi-color and Venustus. I have always kept lots of rock in my tanks. My 125 was a 24" tall tank and the rock went from bottom to top, So there was lots of hiding spaces for the little angels. When I added the flamebacks to my 400g I bought one for myself and one for a friend. I put the second fish in the acclimation box till my friend could pick it up. Once the fish went into the box, the original flameback didn't leave the side of the acclimation box. After 5 days of the two fish sitting side by side (one in the box and one in the tank) I let my friend know he would have to wait for a flameback and released him into the tank. Dave B __________________ 560g Display. 1500g System Volume. (2) 180g Outdoor Frag Tanks. 340g Sump, 30g 2 story surge tank. Dasatco EXT 9. Bubble King Skimmer. Ozone. UV. 5' Fluidized Sand Filter. Avast Kalk Mixer. Current Tank Info: 560g SPS Dominant Reef / 1500g Total System

07/19/2013, 05:42 PM	#16
Sheol Registered Member Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: Waxahachie, Tx. Posts: 3,610	Currently, I still have my C. bicolor & my African Flameback in the 60 gallon mushroom/softy Reef. There were fireworks the first week the C. acanthops ( I think that is the right binomial but could be wrong, going on my now Over the Hill Memory here!) was in there. The Bicolor had had free run of the tank & was more than twice the size of the AFB. However, things turned around. Actually, kind of glad that thing is not bigger! Detente has since been reached. Sincerely, Matthew

07/20/2013, 02:57 PM	#17
PatrickFul10 Registered Member Join Date: Jul 2013 Location: Louisville, KY Posts: 14	thanks to everyone for all the good stories and tips. i may attempt it with an acclimation box. i do in fact have a plan b. i have a reef tank upstairs i could put one in.