Dana's 120 reef from scratch

damamarr · 09/29/2013, 06:28 AM

Hi everyone, I'm new to the site. We just got a new 120 gal tank, unfortunately no overflows so we had to go the canister filter route. We plan on doing a overflow box to a sump in the near future.

Current Specs:
Tank: 4X2X2
Fluval 406 Canister
2 Powerheads to keep the water flowing
Aquatic Life 48" with 2 T5 actinic, 2 power compact 10,000K, and 3 moon light leds
We have a deep sand bed of about 3"

Water Quality:
Temp 80 deg F
Salinity: 1.022
Ca: 600 PPM
KH: 17 dKh
PO: 1 PPM
NO3: 40 PPM
PH: 7.8

We only have one piece of live rock in there now, we are trying a fishless cycle... My ultimate goal is to have some clams this time around. Look foward to posting more!

damamarr · 09/29/2013, 07:03 AM

Here are the pics of it.

Aello · 09/29/2013, 02:15 PM

I have a question if you don't mind. Why don't you just build in an overflow now and not,have to worry about it later down the road. It's really easy and cheap to do.

Aello · 09/29/2013, 02:15 PM

Plus it gets rid of the canister filter which will end up being a lot more work in the long term

damamarr · 09/29/2013, 04:44 PM

We eventually plan to put in the sump, we just got a really good deal on the canister.. I'd like to DIY it, and have all the equipment in there under the stand... I've decided to keep my qt filter running in my dt to keep it up on the bio life so I can just put in some main water and hook up the filter, so with that and the protein skimmer etc hanging on right now it looks super crappy... Lol. So yea I agree, just need the time and money as it's Sunday and work starts tomorrow again

, slow and steady right?

Aello · 09/29/2013, 05:48 PM

Taking your time is the Best way to do it. Just as a simple yet good way to do the overflow you can get 2 sheets of glass from a glass supplier and make your corner overflow from that should not cost much more than 20 bucks for that, silicone and if you want to a acrylic covering for it. I made my overflow from a pvc sheet and bent it, because it's in the middle of my tank. I then cut out all the overflow slots and installed it, I wish I would have done the glass overflow though it's a bit more sturdy. But you have it right slowly taking your time is going to be the best way.

damamarr · 09/29/2013, 06:26 PM

Ok I'm not the best engineer, so you drilled your tank or did you do a siphon type overflow off the back? My husband and I have been discussing this as we don't wanna ruin the tank....? And specs or a plan or something would be greatly appreciated!!! I've been thinking over the sump plans, and looking at some of the build threads.... Awesome work there!

Aello · 09/29/2013, 06:52 PM

Well for my tank, I drilled the back with three holes on the side, two for the overflow to the sump and one to feed my chiller. I also drilled the return holes. If you want to drill the tank, it's once again good to take your time and be patient. I can lay out a simple plan and if you would like more detail or a picture or anything please ask, I have no problem helping you out.
First thing to do is determine how many gph you want to run through your return from your sump. This needs to be looked at for 2 reasons.
1 it will determine how big of a pump you need
2 it will determine the size of bulkhead you should use.
Once you figure that out you can choose the overflow wall you want, coast to coast, corner, or middle. Then if you choose anything other than coast to coast, it would be better to drill the side of your tank, leave about 1 1/2" AT LEAST between any edge of the glass and the hole for your bulkhead the more room you can get between that the better. At this point you can also either drill the return bulkhead holes or leave them for an over the side return. If you want a safe overflow that will be quiet I would go herbie. I did a slight variation on herbie with only two standpipes but I also designed my system so that if a pump fails, or the overflow becomes blocked nothing will ever overflow. Once you get past the decision phase it's really simple and kinda fun customizing your aquarium. If you need drilling advice go slow, plenty of water and once you get close to breaking through go a bit faster but apply the same pressure and you won't ruin the tank.

If you don't mind me offering my advice I would do an internal coast to coast overflow, with 2 returns built on either side of the overflow, I would use 1" pipe for the pluming from tank to sump and 1 1/2" from. Sump to tank. I say that because that will lower the head pressure and help keep up the flow. with that setup it will be efficient, clean looking and also provide just as much flow as you need if not you could add a small powerhead or two but keeping the return flow high, will keep the water moving enough to limit the need for spacing taking powerheads.

Aello · 09/29/2013, 06:55 PM

As a side note, if you can get some more rock in there it will help in the long run, then your not trying to play catch up with the bacteria when you start stocking your tank.

silentstorm · 09/29/2013, 08:12 PM

@aello - reading through your plumbing recommendation, I thought its good to have a bigger size pipe from the tank to the sump draining while the return size is a little small than the drain pipe.
But I see you mentioned the other way 1" from tank to sump & 1 1/2 " for sump to tank.

Any particular reason or was it a typo??

Aello · 09/29/2013, 08:43 PM

Well the return plumbing can be a bit larger, this allows for less head loss which will improve the return flow back to the tank. The reason I recommended 1" for the drain pipes is because unless you want to add ball valves to the drain plumbing 1" provides a good amount of draining at full siphon and will be helped out by the secondary drain. If you go larger the more water will come down to the sump, which means either a bigger return pump or throttling back the drain. Putting a valve on the drain can be finicky to tune and can more easily cause a blockage. It's a personal preference I have found to work best. If you want you can do 1 1/2" pipe and still use the 1" bulkheads but you also need to match that with the pump.

damamarr · 09/30/2013, 05:33 AM

Ok, i'll work on drawing up some ideas, and then i'll put them up here for you to analyze... so you are saying two returns per side? How deep down do you drill the bulkhead holes? Sorry for all the rookie questions, lol. As for the rock we plan on much more, but again doing so without going for broke! We spent alot this weekend on the light system alone.... I plan on about 1-1/2 lbs per gal. Putting in livestock isn't really a priority right now, and when we get it they are going to qt for a while before hand anyway so I see it as we have plenty of time

. As far as the tank size for the sump I was thinking a 55, does that sound about right, I figure that'll be about half the volume of water from the DT?

damamarr · 09/30/2013, 05:35 AM

Our last tank we didn't QT and wound up with a horrible infestation of aptasia, we didn't watch the LR prior to dropping it in the tank.

dc · 09/30/2013, 08:24 AM

This thread has been moved to the current forum.....

Aello · 09/30/2013, 10:51 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by damamarr

Ok, i'll work on drawing up some ideas, and then i'll put them up here for you to analyze... so you are saying two returns per side? How deep down do you drill the bulkhead holes? Sorry for all the rookie questions, lol. As for the rock we plan on much more, but again doing so without going for broke! We spent alot this weekend on the light system alone.... I plan on about 1-1/2 lbs per gal. Putting in livestock isn't really a priority right now, and when we get it they are going to qt for a while before hand anyway so I see it as we have plenty of time

. As far as the tank size for the sump I was thinking a 55, does that sound about right, I figure that'll be about half the volume of water from the DT?

Sorry I should have been more clear, I ment 1 return on each side of the coast to coast overflow. As for drilling the holes at a minimum leave about 3" from the rim of the tank to the side of the bulkhead hole. Yes a 55 sounds about right, if you can get a 75 they are a bit better to work with, but a 55 is a great sump idea. Just remember more water volume the better. You seem to be doing a great job taking your time, keep up the good work lol. To many people rush things.

damamarr · 09/30/2013, 03:44 PM

Ok so today we got a good 25 pounds of live rock, and some more dead rock to put into the tank! Can't wait, I figure since the tank is bare still we can just dump them in there to help quicken up the cycle of the tank.... Im so excited to see the new rock in there.

Aello · 09/30/2013, 03:53 PM

Turn the temp up a little bit to 81-82 that will help cycle faster as well

damamarr · 09/30/2013, 03:58 PM

That's easy enough, I've got it sitting at 80 right now, I was doing some reading on the temperatures and the health of the reef. It was said that the natural temp of the reefs are higher in the low 80's but we usually keep ours in the 70's. It was suggested that was because of the parasites that thrive in the warmth?? It's worth a try, makes sense that the cycle will go quicker with the higher temp tho.... when the hubby gets home with the rock i'll take some progress pics of the rock and the tank. It's really cleared up now

Aello · 09/30/2013, 06:07 PM

That's good, I am glad to hear it. When you get ready for fish or corals, then go back down in temp to 78 or 80 whichever like you said. Higher temps cause things to metabolize quicker that works for the good and the bad in a reef tank, 78-80 seems to be about the most used temp range for a reef. I keep mine at 80.

damamarr · 10/02/2013, 01:25 PM

Update for my lovely tank.... we got a sump on the way! Im really excited, it has the external overflow box and all that jazz. I figure that we are going to use it as a fuge and put the chaeto and some LR in it with the skimmer. It'll be nice to get most of our stuff off of the back of the tank. Our LR that we got the other day has a TON of feather dusters on it, it's pretty cool to see life in the tank already, can't wait to start looking at some corals!

Aello · 10/04/2013, 11:58 AM

How is your tank doing? When do you get your sump and overflow?

damamarr · 10/04/2013, 05:40 PM

Its good working on some of the plumbing issues now, the overflow box was terrible so hubby DIYd a new one with some PVC, we found a leak so that is curing tonight, by tomorrow (fingers crossed) we will get it up and running. Checked my levels last night, Ammo 0, nitrite 0, nitrate 40 ppm, looking good! Still have the temp at 81 deg, sal at 1.034..... we found this yellow stuff growing on one of our rocks, im not sure if it's a sponge, it was a dead rock so it seemed strange.....

damamarr · 10/04/2013, 05:45 PM

sump.jpg inside cabinet.jpg

overflow 2.jpg

overflow.jpg

tubing.jpg

Aello · 10/04/2013, 08:07 PM

Your husband has some skills, it looks really nice!

damamarr · 10/05/2013, 08:58 AM

Thanks!!! SO this morning we got the sump evened out!!!!

and we got the protein skimmer up and running in there, so I'd say we are good to go. Last thing I need to buy now is a good RO/DI system and a calcium reactor... I can't wait to start with some soft coral frags, Im thinking mushrooms would be a good starter or maybe a finger leather.

09/29/2013, 06:28 AM	#1
damamarr Registered Member Join Date: Sep 2013 Posts: 12	Dana's 120 reef from scratch Hi everyone, I'm new to the site. We just got a new 120 gal tank, unfortunately no overflows so we had to go the canister filter route. We plan on doing a overflow box to a sump in the near future. Current Specs: Tank: 4X2X2 Fluval 406 Canister 2 Powerheads to keep the water flowing Aquatic Life 48" with 2 T5 actinic, 2 power compact 10,000K, and 3 moon light leds We have a deep sand bed of about 3" Water Quality: Temp 80 deg F Salinity: 1.022 Ca: 600 PPM KH: 17 dKh PO: 1 PPM NO3: 40 PPM PH: 7.8 We only have one piece of live rock in there now, we are trying a fishless cycle... My ultimate goal is to have some clams this time around. Look foward to posting more!

09/29/2013, 08:12 PM	#10
silentstorm Registered Member Join Date: Aug 2013 Posts: 96	Plumbing question @aello - reading through your plumbing recommendation, I thought its good to have a bigger size pipe from the tank to the sump draining while the return size is a little small than the drain pipe. But I see you mentioned the other way 1" from tank to sump & 1 1/2 " for sump to tank. Any particular reason or was it a typo??

09/30/2013, 08:24 AM	#14
dc Moderator Emeritus Join Date: Mar 2001 Location: Wyoming Posts: 44,684	This thread has been moved to the current forum..... __________________ Debi ~60 Cube~ Why? Because I said so of course. -Sent via Tapatalk Smoke Signals-

10/04/2013, 05:45 PM	#23
damamarr Registered Member Join Date: Sep 2013 Posts: 12	the pics sump.jpg inside cabinet.jpg overflow 2.jpg overflow.jpg tubing.jpg

09/29/2013, 02:15 PM	#3
Aello Registered Member Join Date: Aug 2013 Location: Blairsville Pa Posts: 101	I have a question if you don't mind. Why don't you just build in an overflow now and not,have to worry about it later down the road. It's really easy and cheap to do.

09/29/2013, 04:44 PM	#5
damamarr Registered Member Join Date: Sep 2013 Posts: 12	We eventually plan to put in the sump, we just got a really good deal on the canister.. I'd like to DIY it, and have all the equipment in there under the stand... I've decided to keep my qt filter running in my dt to keep it up on the bio life so I can just put in some main water and hook up the filter, so with that and the protein skimmer etc hanging on right now it looks super crappy... Lol. So yea I agree, just need the time and money as it's Sunday and work starts tomorrow again , slow and steady right?

09/29/2013, 05:48 PM	#6
Aello Registered Member Join Date: Aug 2013 Location: Blairsville Pa Posts: 101	Taking your time is the Best way to do it. Just as a simple yet good way to do the overflow you can get 2 sheets of glass from a glass supplier and make your corner overflow from that should not cost much more than 20 bucks for that, silicone and if you want to a acrylic covering for it. I made my overflow from a pvc sheet and bent it, because it's in the middle of my tank. I then cut out all the overflow slots and installed it, I wish I would have done the glass overflow though it's a bit more sturdy. But you have it right slowly taking your time is going to be the best way.

09/29/2013, 06:26 PM	#7
damamarr Registered Member Join Date: Sep 2013 Posts: 12	Ok I'm not the best engineer, so you drilled your tank or did you do a siphon type overflow off the back? My husband and I have been discussing this as we don't wanna ruin the tank....? And specs or a plan or something would be greatly appreciated!!! I've been thinking over the sump plans, and looking at some of the build threads.... Awesome work there!

09/29/2013, 06:52 PM	#8
Aello Registered Member Join Date: Aug 2013 Location: Blairsville Pa Posts: 101	Well for my tank, I drilled the back with three holes on the side, two for the overflow to the sump and one to feed my chiller. I also drilled the return holes. If you want to drill the tank, it's once again good to take your time and be patient. I can lay out a simple plan and if you would like more detail or a picture or anything please ask, I have no problem helping you out. First thing to do is determine how many gph you want to run through your return from your sump. This needs to be looked at for 2 reasons. 1 it will determine how big of a pump you need 2 it will determine the size of bulkhead you should use. Once you figure that out you can choose the overflow wall you want, coast to coast, corner, or middle. Then if you choose anything other than coast to coast, it would be better to drill the side of your tank, leave about 1 1/2" AT LEAST between any edge of the glass and the hole for your bulkhead the more room you can get between that the better. At this point you can also either drill the return bulkhead holes or leave them for an over the side return. If you want a safe overflow that will be quiet I would go herbie. I did a slight variation on herbie with only two standpipes but I also designed my system so that if a pump fails, or the overflow becomes blocked nothing will ever overflow. Once you get past the decision phase it's really simple and kinda fun customizing your aquarium. If you need drilling advice go slow, plenty of water and once you get close to breaking through go a bit faster but apply the same pressure and you won't ruin the tank. If you don't mind me offering my advice I would do an internal coast to coast overflow, with 2 returns built on either side of the overflow, I would use 1" pipe for the pluming from tank to sump and 1 1/2" from. Sump to tank. I say that because that will lower the head pressure and help keep up the flow. with that setup it will be efficient, clean looking and also provide just as much flow as you need if not you could add a small powerhead or two but keeping the return flow high, will keep the water moving enough to limit the need for spacing taking powerheads.

09/29/2013, 06:55 PM	#9
Aello Registered Member Join Date: Aug 2013 Location: Blairsville Pa Posts: 101	As a side note, if you can get some more rock in there it will help in the long run, then your not trying to play catch up with the bacteria when you start stocking your tank.

09/29/2013, 08:43 PM	#11
Aello Registered Member Join Date: Aug 2013 Location: Blairsville Pa Posts: 101	Well the return plumbing can be a bit larger, this allows for less head loss which will improve the return flow back to the tank. The reason I recommended 1" for the drain pipes is because unless you want to add ball valves to the drain plumbing 1" provides a good amount of draining at full siphon and will be helped out by the secondary drain. If you go larger the more water will come down to the sump, which means either a bigger return pump or throttling back the drain. Putting a valve on the drain can be finicky to tune and can more easily cause a blockage. It's a personal preference I have found to work best. If you want you can do 1 1/2" pipe and still use the 1" bulkheads but you also need to match that with the pump.

09/30/2013, 05:33 AM	#12
damamarr Registered Member Join Date: Sep 2013 Posts: 12	Ok, i'll work on drawing up some ideas, and then i'll put them up here for you to analyze... so you are saying two returns per side? How deep down do you drill the bulkhead holes? Sorry for all the rookie questions, lol. As for the rock we plan on much more, but again doing so without going for broke! We spent alot this weekend on the light system alone.... I plan on about 1-1/2 lbs per gal. Putting in livestock isn't really a priority right now, and when we get it they are going to qt for a while before hand anyway so I see it as we have plenty of time . As far as the tank size for the sump I was thinking a 55, does that sound about right, I figure that'll be about half the volume of water from the DT?

09/30/2013, 05:35 AM	#13
damamarr Registered Member Join Date: Sep 2013 Posts: 12	Our last tank we didn't QT and wound up with a horrible infestation of aptasia, we didn't watch the LR prior to dropping it in the tank.

09/30/2013, 03:44 PM	#16
damamarr Registered Member Join Date: Sep 2013 Posts: 12	Ok so today we got a good 25 pounds of live rock, and some more dead rock to put into the tank! Can't wait, I figure since the tank is bare still we can just dump them in there to help quicken up the cycle of the tank.... Im so excited to see the new rock in there.

09/30/2013, 03:53 PM	#17
Aello Registered Member Join Date: Aug 2013 Location: Blairsville Pa Posts: 101	Turn the temp up a little bit to 81-82 that will help cycle faster as well

09/30/2013, 03:58 PM	#18
damamarr Registered Member Join Date: Sep 2013 Posts: 12	That's easy enough, I've got it sitting at 80 right now, I was doing some reading on the temperatures and the health of the reef. It was said that the natural temp of the reefs are higher in the low 80's but we usually keep ours in the 70's. It was suggested that was because of the parasites that thrive in the warmth?? It's worth a try, makes sense that the cycle will go quicker with the higher temp tho.... when the hubby gets home with the rock i'll take some progress pics of the rock and the tank. It's really cleared up now

09/30/2013, 06:07 PM	#19
Aello Registered Member Join Date: Aug 2013 Location: Blairsville Pa Posts: 101	That's good, I am glad to hear it. When you get ready for fish or corals, then go back down in temp to 78 or 80 whichever like you said. Higher temps cause things to metabolize quicker that works for the good and the bad in a reef tank, 78-80 seems to be about the most used temp range for a reef. I keep mine at 80.

10/02/2013, 01:25 PM	#20
damamarr Registered Member Join Date: Sep 2013 Posts: 12	Update for my lovely tank.... we got a sump on the way! Im really excited, it has the external overflow box and all that jazz. I figure that we are going to use it as a fuge and put the chaeto and some LR in it with the skimmer. It'll be nice to get most of our stuff off of the back of the tank. Our LR that we got the other day has a TON of feather dusters on it, it's pretty cool to see life in the tank already, can't wait to start looking at some corals!

10/04/2013, 11:58 AM	#21
Aello Registered Member Join Date: Aug 2013 Location: Blairsville Pa Posts: 101	How is your tank doing? When do you get your sump and overflow?

10/04/2013, 05:40 PM	#22
damamarr Registered Member Join Date: Sep 2013 Posts: 12	Its good working on some of the plumbing issues now, the overflow box was terrible so hubby DIYd a new one with some PVC, we found a leak so that is curing tonight, by tomorrow (fingers crossed) we will get it up and running. Checked my levels last night, Ammo 0, nitrite 0, nitrate 40 ppm, looking good! Still have the temp at 81 deg, sal at 1.034..... we found this yellow stuff growing on one of our rocks, im not sure if it's a sponge, it was a dead rock so it seemed strange.....

10/04/2013, 08:07 PM	#24
Aello Registered Member Join Date: Aug 2013 Location: Blairsville Pa Posts: 101	Your husband has some skills, it looks really nice!

10/05/2013, 08:58 AM	#25
damamarr Registered Member Join Date: Sep 2013 Posts: 12	Thanks!!! SO this morning we got the sump evened out!!!! and we got the protein skimmer up and running in there, so I'd say we are good to go. Last thing I need to buy now is a good RO/DI system and a calcium reactor... I can't wait to start with some soft coral frags, Im thinking mushrooms would be a good starter or maybe a finger leather.