Cycling question for new 120g tank

[droog]

Hi,

I'm currently making up water for my new 120g tank, live rock and substrate being delivered by my LFS this weekend. All equipment is brand new

Tank: Red Sea S-Max 300
Skimmer: Red Sea C1800
Filtration: Carbon placed in bag nr skimmer

In addition I have purchased a couple of pumps and reactors, and have chemipure elite, GAC and phosban media to hand. I'm shooting for low phosphates and good water chemistry for keeping SPS corals.

Questions

1] Is it best to add LR and substrate at the same time, or wait and add substrate after LR has cycled? Does it depends on the condition of the LR?

2] Is ghost feeding a suitable way to introduce ammonia to start the cycle or is a raw shrimp better? How long should I ghost feed - or if shrimp, how long to leave it in there to decay? Let it rot completely or take out after a certain time / level. Or dose ammonia directly one time and be done? That would be attractive as I'll be going on vacation for a week or two. I'm setup with ATO so can leave it unattended while cycling

3] Is it a good idea to run the Skimmer, Biopellet and Phosban reactors from Day 1 while the cycle is running, or would it make more sense to start running biopellets after my fist post-cycle WC? The skimmer I think is best to run, but the reactors I could see arguments both ways.

4] Plan to keep the tank warmer than usual (say 28C) and no lights to get the beneficial bacteria replicating quickly. Does this make sense? I'll drop temp to 24-25 when the cycle is done

-droog

[rfgonzo]

1) Cure your LR first then add LR and substrte to begin your cycle.
2) You can ghost feed or raw shrimp both will work. Some people take the shrimp out I just let it decay completely.
3) Personal preference some people run it some don't.
4) If curing keep lights off, If cycling turn your lights on for 4 to 6 hours a day.

[thegrun]

Place the rock in the tank first. I like to place the rock on a sheet of egg crate to help anchor the rock in place, otherwise it will shift over time from the weight of the rock above and from the pressure of the sand as it shifts around. Even if you don't use egg crate place the rock first so that it sits on the solid tank bottom, not on top of sand which will shift and could cause a rockslide. After you have your aquascape how you like it add the sand, then premixed saltwater. The last few tanks I've set up I've used pure (10%) ammonia to start the cycle but the shrimp method works well also. I like the pure ammonia simply because it saves a few days in the cycle duration. To raise 100 gallons of water from 0 to 3 ppm you would need to add 1.2grams (12 ml) of standard 10% pure ammonia without surfactants. I also start a light daily ghost feeding from the start. I would run the skimmer from the start to break it in, but would wait until the ammonia drops before running anything else. I don't know if the elevated temperatures will help or hurt, hopefully someone with experience can chime in on that.

[SGT_York]

Rock first but place the sand in prior to your cycle starting to start the bacteria growth in the sand as well.

[3dees]

when I set up my 120 gal. I filled tank with ro/di, turned on the powerheads and heater, and started adding salt. the next day I added sand. waited two days for my 140 lbs. of live rock to be delivered. put lr in and my tank cycled in 10 days without adding ammonia or shrimp. if your going with smaller pieces of lr or a dsb then put rock before sand. I only have an inch of sand and my bottom rocks are big and heavy.

[DasCamel]

Rock cycling with sand is cool, just be ready to siphon the crude off the sand as it cycles.

[Terefel]

Originally Posted by thegrun

Place the rock in the tank first. I like to place the rock on a sheet of egg crate to help anchor the rock in place, otherwise it will shift over time from the weight of the rock above and from the pressure of the sand as it shifts around. Even if you don't use egg crate place the rock first so that it sits on the solid tank bottom, not on top of sand which will shift and could cause a rockslide. After you have your aquascape how you like it add the sand, then premixed saltwater. The last few tanks I've set up I've used pure (10%) ammonia to start the cycle but the shrimp method works well also. I like the pure ammonia simply because it saves a few days in the cycle duration. To raise 100 gallons of water from 0 to 3 ppm you would need to add 1.2grams (12 ml) of standard 10% pure ammonia without surfactants. I also start a light daily ghost feeding from the start. I would run the skimmer from the start to break it in, but would wait until the ammonia drops before running anything else. I don't know if the elevated temperatures will help or hurt, hopefully someone with experience can chime in on that.

Sorry to barge into this thread but I am getting ready to start my cycle tonight as well - thegrun, where did you get the pure ammonia without surfactants? Is this something that can be found at a grocery store, drug store, or local big box hardware store? Also, does any of your above recommendation change if I have had my dry rock "curing" in heated saltwater in a trashcan for the last month?

Thanks so much!

Edit: research online shows 10% surfractant free ammonia can be found at Ace.

[droog]

Originally Posted by thegrun

Place the rock in the tank first. I like to place the rock on a sheet of egg crate to help anchor the rock in place, otherwise it will shift over time from the weight of the rock above and from the pressure of the sand as it shifts around. Even if you don't use egg crate place the rock first so that it sits on the solid tank bottom, not on top of sand which will shift and could cause a rockslide. After you have your aquascape how you like it add the sand, then premixed saltwater. The last few tanks I've set up I've used pure (10%) ammonia to start the cycle but the shrimp method works well also. I like the pure ammonia simply because it saves a few days in the cycle duration. To raise 100 gallons of water from 0 to 3 ppm you would need to add 1.2grams (12 ml) of standard 10% pure ammonia without surfactants. I also start a light daily ghost feeding from the start. I would run the skimmer from the start to break it in, but would wait until the ammonia drops before running anything else.

Thanks, I'll run the skimmer from the beginning, and the other reactors at the end of the cycle.

Originally Posted by thegrun

I don't know if the elevated temperatures will help or hurt, hopefully someone with experience can chime in on that.

I don't have experience, but came across an article while reading. Same stuff in many places but one example here.

[r_okeanos]

would all the hitchhikers in the live rock die? should we just add more live rock again later? I have always read that it regrows but some of the LR pieces usually come with oysters, sponges etc that I feel would not survive the cycling process.

[Terefel]

Using thegrun's information on ammonia, I managed to dose to an initial ammonia level of almost 2 ppm exactly.

Thanks again for helping kick-start my cycle!