Cycle question

[Travish881]

So it's been 8 days running my tank and I have 30lbs live sand and 45lbs LR in a 36g bowfront.
First test 3 days in: Ammonia 4-8ppm
Nitrites 2.5pp
S.G 1.025

3 Days later Ammonia 0.25ppm
Nitrites 5.0ppm

Just tested today on the 8th day and ammonia is at zero and nitrites are off the color chart so my question is am I almost through with this cycle or should I be expecting another ammonia spike again just didn't think it was going to go so fast.

[zsxking]

You are in the middle of it. ammonia is zero because they all got turned to nitrite, and usually happen fast. Getting nitrite to zero is the longer wait.

[thatreefguy22]

I never even got to see my nitrites go up. but it's different for everyone. I used a lot of live rock with die off already on it, and full live sand.

I'm almost 5 months in on my tank!
2 clown fish were added back in november.
my first coral I got in the beginning of this month.

But, you're in the middle of it, watch for a drop in nitrites, nitrates should then begin to rise. when your nitrate goes up...just do a water change.

[brandon429]

api test kit used here? always is.

need to see pics to see if rock has dieoff

it likely does not and this is a wrong reading, thats typical can you let us know the details and pics

[brandon429]

presence of nitrate means there is no cycling, just questionable ammonia and dieoff will be obvious, instead of just coralline coating the rocks, there will be heavy macros and tubeworms and sponges etc or large worms dead on the inside. exceptional porosity might allow for that, and pics of good detail will show it.

there are ways to contaminate the results of api test kits accidentally, using prime is one way and thats ironic because ammonia was the initial concern, you may not have any ammonia problems in this tank unless you added a dead shrimp

if your lr is cured, and you brought it home with a short trip from the local store and set it up, I bet there is no cycle and this is one of a long, long list of api threads google will show having terrible over readings. its also possible your lr isn't cured or that an ammonia source was added and its legit...pics will show.

its fun to see how many predictions can be typed before actual pics are posted and verifications off other non api test kits

[brandon429]

search this on google to clarify not just my take on api

"api marine test kit always shows .25 ppm ammonia"

or

"api marine test kit gives false reading"

its about 100000 results lol

[Travish881]

The LR was not cured will add photos when I get home. There is quite a bit of die off right now bought the LR from live aquaria so I believe the rock is in the curing phase I suppose

[brandon429]

Sure that makes sense

I recommend big water changes, as ammonia kills more and more life that may otherwise live.

Your bacteria aren't in question, so ammonia is not needed. Neutralize it and do big water changes, keep it zero to preserve as much life as possible.

Dry rock cycling = ammonia needed to feed bacteria

Uncured rock has the most bacteria ever, but dying macro organisms are producing ammonia and killing weaker animals. Reduction and elimination of free ammonia in the water is the goal, that can be done artificially preserving the most life and diversity, or you can let it stop naturally which means all death ran its course. Less diversity, your choice no big deal wither way. Good chat about cycling.

[brandon429]

What about the API part

[Travish881]

Yea it's an API test lol

[Travish881]

image.jpg
So my basic question is is my tank cycling ammonia spiked went down and nitrites are going up and thanks to everyone for chiming in

[brandon429]

I don't see any source of dieoff from the LR.

The google searches show API nitrite to be easily contaminated as mentioned, ammonia to usually read .25 even in established tanks, so we cannot take any information provided as indicative of cycling. Params from non API test kits have to be known or we are just guessing. They are that unhelpful as marine test kits. The tank should have a total water change. Coralline spotting indicates some time underwater, the ability to produce nitrate and oxidize ammonia within the rock (coralline spotting is a powerful indicator of resident bacteria establishment) and no benthic growth and low porosity means the rock isn't a strong source of ammonia.

We cannot tell if your rock is cycling with the information provided. How long had your rock been in a marine tank before you bought it, call the lfs to ask if needed

[Travish881]

I guess I'll go to my LFS and have them test my water for me

[brandon429]

Cool, try to take a pic of their actual reading w smartphone so we can see that w be neat

If it indicates ammonia we can try to see what living animals are on that coralline spotted rock that have died that are leaking ammonia. The tank needs a full water change.

What are the dark spots on the live sand, did that come from another reef tank, or was it bagged

True live sand from an established reef tank imports waste the new tank isn't used to seeing or built up to. The sand looks more aged than Fiji pink sand from caribsea.


While at lfs I'd consider buying simple cured LR, use this as base rock for it or trade this back in. That way you can come home and get your tank ready for use now vs using non cured rocks. Price isn't a big deal, they are covered in coralline and look better and more aged.

Premium cured LR is simply coated in coralline and ready to go with no cycling.

[Travish881]

Will do

[Travish881]

Originally Posted by brandon429

I don't see any source of dieoff from the LR.

The google searches show API nitrite to be easily contaminated as mentioned, ammonia to usually read .25 even in established tanks, so we cannot take any information provided as indicative of cycling. Params from non API test kits have to be known or we are just guessing. They are that unhelpful as marine test kits. The tank should have a total water change. Coralline spotting indicates some time underwater, the ability to produce nitrate and oxidize ammonia within the rock (coralline spotting is a powerful indicator of resident bacteria establishment) and no benthic growth and low porosity means the rock isn't a strong source of ammonia.

We cannot tell if your rock is cycling with the information provided. How long had your rock been in a marine tank before you bought it, call the lfs to ask if needed

Missed your last question I bought my live rock from liveaquaria so I'm not sure how long they had it in a marine tank or if they'd even know

[brandon429]

Ok I see that helps to know, what about the live sand.

Based on pics it looks like they sold rocks that may not be aged much, vs marine rock that is crusted with growth but not cured to aquarium conditions yet, its in need of more time underwater. Your live sand depending on source has filtration abilities we just need to know if it has waste in it too.

As is, you have a tank with lower filtration ability than one using fully cured LR but in time these rocks will purple up too. Options are get accurate ammonia test to use at home and use ammonia presence to further develop the tank, or add cured LR, clean the sand in a nice water change, plan your initial bioload around this known cured substrate, and wait for the other rocks to age before increasing bioload. Thats two different ways to deal with cycling here based on pics and substrate history. We could fully cycle your tank with just that info and pics alone, but if you have to use uncured rock then accurate ammonia testing will be needed. If you buy some cured live rock to add it wont.

[tmz]

At 8 to days, I'd expect nitrite as ammonia oxidizing( nitrifying bacteria) are working. Next you'll see nitrate signaling the end of ammonia oxidation activity. It goes like this NH3/4(ammonia) to nitrite, NO2(bacteria add the oxygen) to NO3 (they add more oxygen. Late on denitrifying bacteria use up the NO3.
Live rock will vary in terms of it's readiness for ammonia oxidation activity , depending on how well it has been cured. Most will require some curing time for die off. More if it's newly shipped. I'd wait a full 10 days without ammonia as secondary spikes are common. Adding a little food will increase the amounts of ammonia and the density of ammonia oxidizing bacteria.

BTW, the api kits are fine for ammonia, nitrite and nitrate.ime and that of many others ; it crosschecks well with the Salifert kits. Just because it's less expensive doesn't make it less useful. Folks have issues with most test kits at one time or another.

[Travish881]

Just got back from lfs they used API as well so showed same readings as I was getting. Going to just keep testing and see how things go. Will try two other lfs tomorrow since they were closed today but just going to keep at it and will post results tomorrow from other lfs

[Travish881]

image.jpg
This on my sand wasn't there during the first few days and gradually started appearing so I'm under the impression that that's die off from the live rock correct ?

[Maxxumless]

The brown stuff on the sand? It's diatoms - didn't read this whole thread, but it's normal during cycling.

[brandon429]

Where did the live sand come from for your tank

[Travish881]

It was Caribbean arag sand 30lbs of it