bleach to clean aquarium

mike54784 · 08/17/2014, 12:50 PM

I had a tank a while back and all my fish ended up dead due to ich. I gave up on having a tank and poured out the water after that happened. My rocks and everything dried up, and I put them outside.

I'm now starting my tank again. I soaked my rocks in a bleach water solution to make sure nothing was still alive on them from having been outside for a year. I now believe that that wasn't the best thing to do because I know the bleach water doesn't get into all of the cracks and crevices deep in the rock. I should have just cooked the rock, but it's too late for that and what's done is done.

After letting the rocks soak in bleach I cooked them in the oven at 350 F for 2 hours to drive the bleach off. I then rinsed them thoroughly. I was told that that should have been enough to break the bleach down.

I put live sand in my tank, with RODI and salt water mix, and have my rock back in the tank. My ammonia level has spiked, but not the nitrite or nitrate yet (It's only been two weeks since I put it all back in the tank.

I'm still worried about the bleach or any contaminate, and just have one quick question here (I don't mean to make this question about sterilizing rock and the best methods to do so).

My question is, if there was any remaining bleach in the tank how would that affect the chemistry of the aquarium. By this I mean I have some thoughts as to how I think it would affect the system, and would indicate to me if there was any still in the system, but wanted some insight as to if I'm thinking about this correctly. If there was still bleach in the system, wouldn't it kill all of the bacteria in the system and thus stop the nitrogen cycle? In other words, wouldn't decomposing stuff turn to ammonia as it breaks down and stay as ammonia rather than converting to nitrite because the bacteria wouldn't be able to survive if there was any remaining bleach in the system?

Or does bacteria cause the breakdown into ammonia also, in which case, if there was bleach that would kill the bacteria that does that, wouldn't ammonia not even spike?

I guess I'm just wondering, if the cycle goes as planned with my ammonia spiking, then going down and nitrite spiking, than nitrate... Wouldn't that mean that the bleach is likely out of the system entirely enough to think it's safe to add fish?

If my ammonia spike stays up without going to nitrite would that indicate that bleach residue is still in the system? or would my ammonia have even of spiked if that was the case?

Thanks in advance

bertoni · 08/17/2014, 01:18 PM

I think that bleaching the rock was safe enough, although probably not necessary. I would avoid heating rock from a tank, since that could volatilize toxins from corals and the like, which could be deadly. That seems like a very bad idea.

The bleach will break down on its own fairly quickly once the rock is in water and there's some circulation. I wouldn't worry about it.

mike54784 · 08/17/2014, 01:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bertoni

I think that bleaching the rock was safe enough, although probably not necessary. I would avoid heating rock from a tank, since that could volatilize toxins from corals and the like, which could be deadly. That seems like a very bad idea.

The bleach will break down on its own fairly quickly once the rock is in water and there's some circulation. I wouldn't worry about it.

Thank you bertoni, that eases my worrying. Just out of curiosity though, what do you mean that it could volatilize toxins from corals and the like? I have seen a few people recommend to do this on reef central. Also, It was just rock. I didn't have coral on the rock or anything. It had been outside for a year in my back yard. Do you mean it could emit toxins in the air as I cooked them? Or did you mean it could loosen something up and hurt my aquarium in the future?

SwampyBill · 08/17/2014, 01:43 PM

I think you should be ok, too. how high was ammonia spike & has nitrites registered ANY reading yet? When people talk of 'cooking rock' on here, it's not about literally putting them in oven & cooking. It means putting them in a tub of fresh saltwater w/ a powerhead & let it sit until the rock becomes live rock again. Welcome back & good luck w/ the new set up!

bertoni · 08/17/2014, 01:53 PM

As you heat the rock, various toxin produced by corals could evaporate and end up in the air. That's a known danger. I haven't heard of anyone recommending baking rock in the oven. The term "cooking" often gets used to refer to curing the rock for a relatively long time in the dark, which I also would avoid. Could you provide some links to threads where people recommend heating rock? I'd like to add some comments to them.

mike54784 · 08/17/2014, 02:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SwampyBill

I think you should be ok, too. how high was ammonia spike & has nitrites registered ANY reading yet? When people talk of 'cooking rock' on here, it's not about literally putting them in oven & cooking. It means putting them in a tub of fresh saltwater w/ a powerhead & let it sit until the rock becomes live rock again. Welcome back & good luck w/ the new set up!

Thanks SwampyBill! and now that I'm going back through posts I see that most of them that is how they recommend to cook live rock. I did see a post that actually recommended using the oven when I first did it, but looking back I can't find it, but can only find a few that state what you did.

My ammonia spiked to .50 ppm, but I have yet to see any spike in nitrite. Hopefully I'll be good to go in a few more weeks.

mike54784 · 08/17/2014, 02:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bertoni

As you heat the rock, various toxin produced by corals could evaporate and end up in the air. That's a known danger. I haven't heard of anyone recommending baking rock in the oven. The term "cooking" often gets used to refer to curing the rock for a relatively long time in the dark, which I also would avoid. Could you provide some links to threads where people recommend heating rock? I'd like to add some comments to them.

Thanks again Bertoni, and looking back I can't find the post that I read stating that actually baking live rock was what to do. I am seeing posts that say to do what you are saying. I'm thinking that someone else misinterpreted the term "cooking live rock," actually did it with an oven, and posted about it. I read that and did the same. Maybe the person was just being sarcastic in saying what he did and I took it literately. I wish I could find the post again. I see now that it was definitely not a great idea and could have exploded. I'm also thinking that the term "cooking" probably isn't an appropriate term for people to be using when describing the process that is actually done by people. It is not in effect "cooking," and could easily mislead newbies.

On a side note, I was also told by a friend to do the same. Although he isn't and has never been into aquariums, he is a biologist and chemist, and he has had terrariums for years with snakes and other reptiles. He said that in the past he has "cooked" wood and other substrate for his tanks through such means as putting everything in a black trash bag and setting it out in the hot sun for a couple weeks to sterilize everything. He also said that heating would drive off the bleach.

Cbsailor11 · 08/17/2014, 02:40 PM

I soaked my rock in bleach/water then multiple rinses in RODI, you should be fine. I have seen people here suggest using Prime when rock has been bleached.

Bertoni- I'm curious as to why you avoid curing in the dark, I am currently doing this for my next tank.

bertoni · 08/17/2014, 02:44 PM

I've never liked the term "cooking rock". Sigh!

As far as why I wouldn't cure for an extended period, I don't think it's worthwhile, and the process will tend to reduce the live animal population over time. Curing long enough for the ammonia to disappear should be enough for dealing with organic debris, and some lanthanum chloride or GFO seems to be enough to remove phosphate.

Cbsailor11 · 08/17/2014, 03:28 PM

Agree "cooking rock" can be taken wrong by people new to the hobby, and cause some nasty results. Read a few Palytoxin stories.

Thanks Bertoni, I thought it was the dark that you avoided. Had issues in my 46g, so trying to do my 180g properly.

OP- sorry for the hijack

mike54784 · 08/17/2014, 05:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cbsailor11

Agree "cooking rock" can be taken wrong by people new to the hobby, and cause some nasty results. Read a few Palytoxin stories.

Thanks Bertoni, I thought it was the dark that you avoided. Had issues in my 46g, so trying to do my 180g properly.

OP- sorry for the hijack

wow, I had never heard of palytoxin! Thanks for letting me know! and to think that my previous lfs tried selling them to me without any warning related to handling. Luckily I passed and just purchased more fish. At least now I know what I'm getting into if I do get them down the road.

tkeracer619 · 08/18/2014, 04:20 PM

If they mentioned to you that the coral potentially had the second most lethal naturally occurring neurotoxin on the planet would you have purchased it?

I'm a survivor and can tell you I will never keep another paly or zoanthid. ____ that!

CuzzA · 08/18/2014, 08:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tkeracer619

If they mentioned to you that the coral potentially had the second most lethal naturally occurring neurotoxin on the planet would you have purchased it?

I'm a survivor and can tell you I will never keep another paly or zoanthid. ____ that!

When doomsday comes, I'm sticking a head of zoanthid on each arrow I shoot at the marauders and zombies.

08/17/2014, 12:50 PM	#1
mike54784 Registered Member Join Date: Apr 2013 Posts: 62	bleach to clean aquarium I had a tank a while back and all my fish ended up dead due to ich. I gave up on having a tank and poured out the water after that happened. My rocks and everything dried up, and I put them outside. I'm now starting my tank again. I soaked my rocks in a bleach water solution to make sure nothing was still alive on them from having been outside for a year. I now believe that that wasn't the best thing to do because I know the bleach water doesn't get into all of the cracks and crevices deep in the rock. I should have just cooked the rock, but it's too late for that and what's done is done. After letting the rocks soak in bleach I cooked them in the oven at 350 F for 2 hours to drive the bleach off. I then rinsed them thoroughly. I was told that that should have been enough to break the bleach down. I put live sand in my tank, with RODI and salt water mix, and have my rock back in the tank. My ammonia level has spiked, but not the nitrite or nitrate yet (It's only been two weeks since I put it all back in the tank. I'm still worried about the bleach or any contaminate, and just have one quick question here (I don't mean to make this question about sterilizing rock and the best methods to do so). My question is, if there was any remaining bleach in the tank how would that affect the chemistry of the aquarium. By this I mean I have some thoughts as to how I think it would affect the system, and would indicate to me if there was any still in the system, but wanted some insight as to if I'm thinking about this correctly. If there was still bleach in the system, wouldn't it kill all of the bacteria in the system and thus stop the nitrogen cycle? In other words, wouldn't decomposing stuff turn to ammonia as it breaks down and stay as ammonia rather than converting to nitrite because the bacteria wouldn't be able to survive if there was any remaining bleach in the system? Or does bacteria cause the breakdown into ammonia also, in which case, if there was bleach that would kill the bacteria that does that, wouldn't ammonia not even spike? I guess I'm just wondering, if the cycle goes as planned with my ammonia spiking, then going down and nitrite spiking, than nitrate... Wouldn't that mean that the bleach is likely out of the system entirely enough to think it's safe to add fish? If my ammonia spike stays up without going to nitrite would that indicate that bleach residue is still in the system? or would my ammonia have even of spiked if that was the case? Thanks in advance

08/17/2014, 01:18 PM	#2
bertoni RC Mod Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Mountain View, CA, USA Posts: 88,616	I think that bleaching the rock was safe enough, although probably not necessary. I would avoid heating rock from a tank, since that could volatilize toxins from corals and the like, which could be deadly. That seems like a very bad idea. The bleach will break down on its own fairly quickly once the rock is in water and there's some circulation. I wouldn't worry about it. __________________ Jonathan Bertoni

08/17/2014, 01:43 PM	#4
SwampyBill Registered Member Join Date: Jan 2010 Location: St. Pete, FL. Posts: 2,369	I think you should be ok, too. how high was ammonia spike & has nitrites registered ANY reading yet? When people talk of 'cooking rock' on here, it's not about literally putting them in oven & cooking. It means putting them in a tub of fresh saltwater w/ a powerhead & let it sit until the rock becomes live rock again. Welcome back & good luck w/ the new set up! __________________ I love me some wrasse... & laissez les bon temps rouler! Current Tank Info: 120 gal Vizio

08/17/2014, 01:53 PM	#5
bertoni RC Mod Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Mountain View, CA, USA Posts: 88,616	As you heat the rock, various toxin produced by corals could evaporate and end up in the air. That's a known danger. I haven't heard of anyone recommending baking rock in the oven. The term "cooking" often gets used to refer to curing the rock for a relatively long time in the dark, which I also would avoid. Could you provide some links to threads where people recommend heating rock? I'd like to add some comments to them. __________________ Jonathan Bertoni

08/17/2014, 02:44 PM	#9
bertoni RC Mod Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Mountain View, CA, USA Posts: 88,616	I've never liked the term "cooking rock". Sigh! As far as why I wouldn't cure for an extended period, I don't think it's worthwhile, and the process will tend to reduce the live animal population over time. Curing long enough for the ammonia to disappear should be enough for dealing with organic debris, and some lanthanum chloride or GFO seems to be enough to remove phosphate. __________________ Jonathan Bertoni

08/17/2014, 02:40 PM	#8
Cbsailor11 Registered Member Join Date: Nov 2013 Posts: 123	I soaked my rock in bleach/water then multiple rinses in RODI, you should be fine. I have seen people here suggest using Prime when rock has been bleached. Bertoni- I'm curious as to why you avoid curing in the dark, I am currently doing this for my next tank.

08/17/2014, 03:28 PM	#10
Cbsailor11 Registered Member Join Date: Nov 2013 Posts: 123	Agree "cooking rock" can be taken wrong by people new to the hobby, and cause some nasty results. Read a few Palytoxin stories. Thanks Bertoni, I thought it was the dark that you avoided. Had issues in my 46g, so trying to do my 180g properly. OP- sorry for the hijack

08/18/2014, 04:20 PM	#12
tkeracer619 Registered Member Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Westminster, CO Posts: 17,289	If they mentioned to you that the coral potentially had the second most lethal naturally occurring neurotoxin on the planet would you have purchased it? I'm a survivor and can tell you I will never keep another paly or zoanthid. ____ that! __________________ Hobby Experience: 9200ish gallons, 26 skimmers, and a handful of Kent Scrapers. Current Tank: Vortech Powered 600G SPS Tank w/ 100gal frag tank & 100g Sump. RK2-RK10 Skimmer. ReefAngel. Radium 20k.