Need parameter advice on s 350g reef ASAP

91Atrac · 01/26/2015, 09:41 PM

Hey everyone,

So little info. Tank is a 350g corner style tank with corner overflow. Has lots of rock (will have a pic). Running 2 tunze nanostream with controller, wp40 and 2 k1-2? Koralias.

I've been trying so many different things to get flow where there isn't any dead spots. Been quite the challenge honestly. Biggest issue has been ammonia. I believe we are seeing nitrates too but this kit makes it very hard to pin point that.

Tank is maybe 3months old. Tunning a bubble magnus curve9 on a 30g sunp with poor refugium size..

Cycle was started with used sand, live but not established live rock and nearly dead live sand. Since starting the tank we used probidio for bacteria. Using omega one salt I think it's called but starting to use IO. Personally I like seachem reef salt better but price matters for my clients.

I'm very new to large reefs but had lots of success with nanos up to 40g.

Any input is much appreciated! Been doing 80g water changes to drop ammonia. Oh and running a vertex 2.0L reactor with 3:1 carbon: gfo with mag9 pump on it(very new to reactors too so no idea what's good flow rate for them.

Help please and thank you!! I'll post a build thread soon as it's dealt with.

JoelA7 · 01/27/2015, 01:21 AM

Normal procedure is not to change water until the cycle is complete. Also not to add livestock during the cycle.

rgulrich · 01/27/2015, 05:51 AM

Heavy/wet skimming, lots of activated carbon, Polyfilter (brand name, look for it) absorbent, and gfo. Good flow for the gfo is "a light tumble" of the media - you want it moving, but not pushing against the top of the container.

Carbon you don't want to move as it will crumble. Polyfilter you want all of the water to pass through it.

Continue with your water changes until the values drop, otherwise fish may suffer ammonia burns and resultant scarring on their gills, and you may lose anything else alive that's sensitive to ammonia and nitrite.

With lots of oxygenation (via your skimmer cranked up) you may get some of the nasties out of solution while getting your bacterial cycle going - and save some of the livestock.

Next time, don't throw livestock into the aquarium until the new rock and sand have cycled and you know the ins and outs of your filtration system. Please.

Ray

ReefsandGeeks · 01/27/2015, 07:58 AM

I didn't see anywhere where the OP said there were fish in the tank. (for some reason my computer doesn't show pictures unless they are attachments so if there is a pic than I may be mistaken). If you don't have fish in there, than it's still cycling so you'll just have to let it go and wait it out. It can take a while to cycle, but it's worth waiting rather than rushing to get fish in. Plus if you do put fish in you'll be franticaly adding chemicals and doing water changes trying to detoxify the cycle which will end up costing a good bit of money for a large tank. Don't add any fish untill you see no ammonia and no nitrite. Nitrate is okay for fish at a reasonable level. Before I got into coral, my FOWLR typicaly had 40ppm Nitrate and I saw no ill effects from the fish compairedto undectectable that I have now. Not good at highly elevated levels though.

rgulrich · 01/27/2015, 10:12 AM

(There are pics, both without and with fish, coral, and clams, among others)

cleverbs · 01/27/2015, 10:19 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 91Atrac

Hey everyone,

So little info. Tank is a 350g corner style tank with corner overflow. Has lots of rock (will have a pic). Running 2 tunze nanostream with controller, wp40 and 2 k1-2? Koralias.

I've been trying so many different things to get flow where there isn't any dead spots. Been quite the challenge honestly. Biggest issue has been ammonia. I believe we are seeing nitrates too but this kit makes it very hard to pin point that.

Tank is maybe 3months old. Tunning a bubble magnus curve9 on a 30g sunp with poor refugium size..

Cycle was started with used sand, live but not established live rock and nearly dead live sand. Since starting the tank we used probidio for bacteria. Using omega one salt I think it's called but starting to use IO. Personally I like seachem reef salt better but price matters for my clients.
I'm very new to large reefs but had lots of success with nanos up to 40g.

Any input is much appreciated! Been doing 80g water changes to drop ammonia. Oh and running a vertex 2.0L reactor with 3:1 carbon: gfo with mag9 pump on it(very new to reactors too so no idea what's good flow rate for them.

some of these comments really concern me. first of all you state you have a client, what on earth are you doing managing an aquarium for a client when you are adding fish before a cycle and whats even more confusing is you dont know how to manage the tank after doing so.

Mishri · 01/27/2015, 10:20 AM

My guess would be you added fish way too fast. You should always build up, add a fish(or 2), let ammonia and nitrites hit 0, then add another. bacteria needs to build up to handle the bio load, no matter how big the tank is.

Also note: there is a lot of mis-information floating around the forums about a tank "cycle" The tank is always cycling. When you add another creature it adds to the bio-load cycle. A tank never "finishes cycling". You just wait for ammonia/nitrites to hit 0, as ammonia and nitrite continue to form in the tank, the bacteria continues to cycle it down. That's what they mean by a cycling though, ammonia = 0 before it's ready for more bio load. I would never add anything dead to "start a cycle" it doesn't really cycle the tank, it just breaks down that ammonia and if there is no new ammonia then that bacteria dies off.

91Atrac · 01/27/2015, 11:41 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mishri

My guess would be you added fish way too fast. You should always build up, add a fish(or 2), let ammonia and nitrites hit 0, then add another. bacteria needs to build up to handle the bio load, no matter how big the tank is.

Also note: there is a lot of mis-information floating around the forums about a tank "cycle" The tank is always cycling. When you add another creature it adds to the bio-load cycle. A tank never "finishes cycling". You just wait for ammonia/nitrites to hit 0, as ammonia and nitrite continue to form in the tank, the bacteria continues to cycle it down. That's what they mean by a cycling though, ammonia = 0 before it's ready for more bio load. I would never add anything dead to "start a cycle" it doesn't really cycle the tank, it just breaks down that ammonia and if there is no new ammonia then that bacteria dies off.

That's a good way to put it and appreciate the kindness. The clients were eager beavers and bought a tank that was being shutdown for cheap. I did feel it was rushing but hey. You can only say so much before things get into a dispute. Either way. Tank seems fine tho as I've set the lights to proper PAR. Just seeing fin rot on a few fish. We had a massive ammonia spike and the clowns got burnt from it and another fish or 2 as well. Corals are all good and even the clams are starting to colour back up since I came into the project.

I came in very late in the setup for the tank and we had lots of issues and we have sump issues (being poor filtration volume caused by small return and overflow that can't handle any more speed. It's a 1 1/4 " overflow and wish I knew its size much earlier but I didn't till it was full.

I've done fast cycles myself often and was easy to control but this tank has so much crap build up . Almost have flow dialed in tho for keeping the detrius from collecting.

01/26/2015, 09:41 PM	#1
91Atrac Registered Member Join Date: Jan 2012 Posts: 408	Need parameter advice on s 350g reef ASAP Hey everyone, So little info. Tank is a 350g corner style tank with corner overflow. Has lots of rock (will have a pic). Running 2 tunze nanostream with controller, wp40 and 2 k1-2? Koralias. I've been trying so many different things to get flow where there isn't any dead spots. Been quite the challenge honestly. Biggest issue has been ammonia. I believe we are seeing nitrates too but this kit makes it very hard to pin point that. Tank is maybe 3months old. Tunning a bubble magnus curve9 on a 30g sunp with poor refugium size.. Cycle was started with used sand, live but not established live rock and nearly dead live sand. Since starting the tank we used probidio for bacteria. Using omega one salt I think it's called but starting to use IO. Personally I like seachem reef salt better but price matters for my clients. I'm very new to large reefs but had lots of success with nanos up to 40g. Any input is much appreciated! Been doing 80g water changes to drop ammonia. Oh and running a vertex 2.0L reactor with 3:1 carbon: gfo with mag9 pump on it(very new to reactors too so no idea what's good flow rate for them. Help please and thank you!! I'll post a build thread soon as it's dealt with.

01/27/2015, 01:21 AM	#2
JoelA7 Registered Member Join Date: Jan 2014 Location: Brookline, MA Posts: 1,056	Normal procedure is not to change water until the cycle is complete. Also not to add livestock during the cycle. __________________ New 48x24x26.25 w Precision Marine R30 sump, Vertex Omega 150 skimmer, 2@Vertex 1.5L reactors for carbon & phosban, GEO Ca reactor w Aquarium Plants regulator. 2 MP40's 2@Radions. #120 live rock & #12

01/27/2015, 05:51 AM	#3
rgulrich greybeard Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: MD Posts: 893	Heavy/wet skimming, lots of activated carbon, Polyfilter (brand name, look for it) absorbent, and gfo. Good flow for the gfo is "a light tumble" of the media - you want it moving, but not pushing against the top of the container. Carbon you don't want to move as it will crumble. Polyfilter you want all of the water to pass through it. Continue with your water changes until the values drop, otherwise fish may suffer ammonia burns and resultant scarring on their gills, and you may lose anything else alive that's sensitive to ammonia and nitrite. With lots of oxygenation (via your skimmer cranked up) you may get some of the nasties out of solution while getting your bacterial cycle going - and save some of the livestock. Next time, don't throw livestock into the aquarium until the new rock and sand have cycled and you know the ins and outs of your filtration system. Please. Ray __________________ The true sign of intelligence is not knowledge but imagination. Albert Einstein Current Tank Info: 360 degree walk around 300 DD island–4 300W & 2 165W ViparSpectra, 4 Kessil A350W, 2 A360WE, 3 XF150, 1 XF250, 1 XF350 Gyre along with 2 PP40 and 2 IceCap 3K gyre for robust current. Basement 150 gallon RubberMaid sump, SKIMZ skimmer, DCP18000

01/27/2015, 10:12 AM	#5
rgulrich greybeard Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: MD Posts: 893	(There are pics, both without and with fish, coral, and clams, among others) __________________ The true sign of intelligence is not knowledge but imagination. Albert Einstein Current Tank Info: 360 degree walk around 300 DD island–4 300W & 2 165W ViparSpectra, 4 Kessil A350W, 2 A360WE, 3 XF150, 1 XF250, 1 XF350 Gyre along with 2 PP40 and 2 IceCap 3K gyre for robust current. Basement 150 gallon RubberMaid sump, SKIMZ skimmer, DCP18000

01/27/2015, 07:58 AM	#4
ReefsandGeeks Registered Member Join Date: Sep 2014 Location: Pittsburgh, PA Posts: 1,708	I didn't see anywhere where the OP said there were fish in the tank. (for some reason my computer doesn't show pictures unless they are attachments so if there is a pic than I may be mistaken). If you don't have fish in there, than it's still cycling so you'll just have to let it go and wait it out. It can take a while to cycle, but it's worth waiting rather than rushing to get fish in. Plus if you do put fish in you'll be franticaly adding chemicals and doing water changes trying to detoxify the cycle which will end up costing a good bit of money for a large tank. Don't add any fish untill you see no ammonia and no nitrite. Nitrate is okay for fish at a reasonable level. Before I got into coral, my FOWLR typicaly had 40ppm Nitrate and I saw no ill effects from the fish compairedto undectectable that I have now. Not good at highly elevated levels though.

01/27/2015, 10:20 AM	#7
Mishri Registered Member Join Date: Jul 2004 Location: Great Falls, MT Posts: 1,404	My guess would be you added fish way too fast. You should always build up, add a fish(or 2), let ammonia and nitrites hit 0, then add another. bacteria needs to build up to handle the bio load, no matter how big the tank is. Also note: there is a lot of mis-information floating around the forums about a tank "cycle" The tank is always cycling. When you add another creature it adds to the bio-load cycle. A tank never "finishes cycling". You just wait for ammonia/nitrites to hit 0, as ammonia and nitrite continue to form in the tank, the bacteria continues to cycle it down. That's what they mean by a cycling though, ammonia = 0 before it's ready for more bio load. I would never add anything dead to "start a cycle" it doesn't really cycle the tank, it just breaks down that ammonia and if there is no new ammonia then that bacteria dies off.