Finally switched from MH to LEDs...

Sk8r · 09/10/2015, 05:26 PM

I'll tell you, carrying 30 lbs of ballast out, plus a monster light kit, in favor of a power supply the size and weight of a lady's purse, and a light kit about the same---my stand is less stuffed, and the light is pretty...

Verdict is pending, but it's pretty. And highly mutable.

I will say, if you're starting in reefing and facing the what-light-do-I-buy-for-reef question, TALK to a lot of people before you commit: lighting is one of the most critical decisions you can make, and there are ways to go wrong with a good unit by not starting with precautions (I'm starting at 50% and ramping it up slowly, 10% at a go, every few days, until I'm satisfied---and even so my fish are confused and wondering what's going on).

Also worth understanding is that, while in the workaday world, red stands for hot and blue stands for cool, blue light is potent in reef lights, and you cannot apply folk wisdom to the lighting choice. Treat blues with respect.

Anyway, just a---'my world has changed' moment, for me and the fishes. It's a brand new world of totally adjustable light, in which talking before doing is a good idea, especially if you're adding it to an extant reef.

I'll post further when I can see how this is working out.

CStrickland · 09/10/2015, 05:44 PM

Good luck!
Are you running regular intervals and just ramping up intensity, or adding hours over time too?

Pmj · 09/10/2015, 09:19 PM

Which LEDs did you go with?

Ron Reefman · 09/11/2015, 04:53 AM

Sk8r, welcome to the world of leds! It took my reef about 2 months to really acclimate from 1000 watts of MH and 160 watts of t5 to new leds. But after that the corals are just as healthy and grow just as well. And I love being able to change the colors in the tank so easily. Not to mention the cost saving. But being at the other end of the country, MH heat was harder to take here in SW Florida, so my chillers (2) and home A/C both work a lot less!

Look forward to your updates.

Sugar Magnolia · 09/11/2015, 05:20 AM

Go slow with ramping up the intensity of the lights.

gone fishin · 09/11/2015, 05:45 AM

Congrats on the move. It took me about 2-3 months to dial in the lights as well.

shifty51008 · 09/11/2015, 05:58 AM

Congrats on the switch, hope you will be very happy with them. I know your tank is mostly lps but if you have any sps can you watch to see how the growth is, ive heard some people say the branches get thinner with leds and such.

toothybugs · 09/11/2015, 06:07 AM

Very cool and congrats

I don't miss my ballast either. I took the plunge in March after years of halides and it didn't take me too long to dial them in to where I liked them. I just bumped up the intensity a bit a couple weeks ago and some new SPS is coloring up really nicely.

billdogg · 09/11/2015, 08:08 AM

Congratulations !

A word of caution however. You might want to start at a lower intensity - say 35% and go up from there. LEDS seem to pack a lot of punch. 2 years in and mine are at 65w/45b/45rb (AI Sol blues x 2 for a 120)

Hth

Sk8r · 09/11/2015, 01:04 PM

Heard and understood. I'm running one Radion Pro in a 105 gallon very deep wedge, and the Pro is the only one I've found that's capable of reaching a 30-36" depth. Because it is a wedge bow tank, it covers well. I'll knock that back a bit. I'm nearly starting over with the reef: I traded off all my coral because of a list of changes ---and because of the fact I realized my light wasn't at all up to the deeper tank, and am down to one piece, which is deep, so I am watching it closely.

3dees · 09/11/2015, 01:09 PM

as much as I love the look of MH, I would never have them instead of LED's. changing bulbs often and dealing with the heat they produce. and then there's the extra cost of electricity. I just don't see any advantages to MH.

Sk8r · 09/11/2015, 06:59 PM

My tank is primarily lps, once I get it up and going. I'll have more data in about six months. Right now I'm just trying to get started out---and there's a lot to learn.

Xxero · 09/14/2015, 11:04 AM

Sk8r, did the switch over cause any odd behaviors in your fish? And if so, in what ways? Are they still acting odd or are they beginning to get used to things now?

ThanX!

Sk8r · 09/14/2015, 11:09 AM

They were spooked, and probably feeling the blues. If I feed with the strong blues on, they're not anxious to go up after the food---so I'm gathering it's a bit intense for them. They are, however, more relaxed at the startup and shutdown---the long blue twilight seems friendly to them, and I'm not seeing the stress they used to show around lights-out. They are settling now, but at brightest, they spend a bit of time in their shelters. (Damsel tank: everybody has a hole.] The coral, which had been sad in the old inadequate lights, is starting to puff up a bit.

Xxero · 09/14/2015, 11:20 AM

Ah, I see. I increased my lighting this past Friday and it seemed to trip my Anthias out a little. She started hanging out in her sleeping spot over the weekend (which she never does), and is just now starting to venture out more. I was thinking it might be the lighting increase, so I was wondering if you experienced any of that as well.

I feel better now. GL!

Sk8r · 09/14/2015, 12:17 PM

Yes: we learn all our lives that red is hot and blue is cool, but in marine, blues go deep and can be quite intense.

nuxx · 09/14/2015, 12:50 PM

Temp in the house drop 10 degrees?

cloak · 09/14/2015, 01:00 PM

Just out of curiosity, does that Radion Pro create that "disco effect" on the bottom of the tank, or is it more like a Kessil A360, kind of white to blue or vice versa? I'm not too familiar with LED's so that's why I'm asking.

Sk8r · 09/14/2015, 01:56 PM

If by disco effect you mean color spots, I have a wedge tank, not a square, and setup has no specific question for 'I have only 3 sides,' so I just gave everything as 36x36 widex36 deep I see a few short stripes of red and blue on my back wall, which is a massive overflow box mottled with coralline and such---a pretty effect there. On the rock and sand, no: I have my light at the recommended height. There is also something during setup that they ask your tank shape and depth, and mine is over 30" deep, which is why I got the Radion Pro, which actually can handle that depth. I can see where that 'depth' question might impact how the lights worked on the sand.

Sk8r · 09/14/2015, 02:32 PM

Mind, I've only used these a week. But I would say if you're starting out---these are definitely a decent route. Back in 2004, I paid big for a Metal Halide kit and then found out the ballasts, which didn't come with them, were just as spendy. I think my total outlay in 2004 dollars was 800.00 for a single 250 watt metal halide with accompanying HO actinic for color balance; and 2 ballasts, which are pretty power-hungry. And I had to replace one 50.00 bulb and two actinics every 8 months. The LEDs right now are definitely worth considering as a start-up option: just be sure what you get is coral-capable. The ones I have come with a number of preset routines that you can then modify via your computer, and you don't need a college degree in physics or electronics or marine biology to set them up. I'm real satisfied with one of the routines, which delivers a pretty and changing range of blues, whites, purples during the day and moonlight for a while at night, and the corals seem to be responding positively.

toothybugs · 09/14/2015, 07:22 PM

I had a very similar start-up experience.

Hitch08 · 09/15/2015, 10:06 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sk8r

Mind, I've only used these a week. But I would say if you're starting out---these are definitely a decent route. Back in 2004, I paid big for a Metal Halide kit and then found out the ballasts, which didn't come with them, were just as spendy. I think my total outlay in 2004 dollars was 800.00 for a single 250 watt metal halide with accompanying HO actinic for color balance; and 2 ballasts, which are pretty power-hungry. And I had to replace one 50.00 bulb and two actinics every 8 months. The LEDs right now are definitely worth considering as a start-up option: just be sure what you get is coral-capable. The ones I have come with a number of preset routines that you can then modify via your computer, and you don't need a college degree in physics or electronics or marine biology to set them up. I'm real satisfied with one of the routines, which delivers a pretty and changing range of blues, whites, purples during the day and moonlight for a while at night, and the corals seem to be responding positively.

Can you let us know which preset you are using? I'm using Radio Pro's as well.

Sk8r · 09/15/2015, 10:23 AM

I'm using the 'radiant' one...I think it may be the second in the sequence. I tinkered with it a little trying to get the 'storms and clouds' to operate, and they tell me you have to save every 'point' on the graph separately, so I need to go back in and do that, but it's producing beautiful colors---does the intense blue thing one morning and one evening, but gradates up to blue white and down to violets.

It's also done in the persistent cyano patch, a side bennie.

09/10/2015, 05:26 PM	#1
Sk8r RC Mod Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: Spokane WA Posts: 34,628 Blog Entries: 55	Finally switched from MH to LEDs... I'll tell you, carrying 30 lbs of ballast out, plus a monster light kit, in favor of a power supply the size and weight of a lady's purse, and a light kit about the same---my stand is less stuffed, and the light is pretty... Verdict is pending, but it's pretty. And highly mutable. I will say, if you're starting in reefing and facing the what-light-do-I-buy-for-reef question, TALK to a lot of people before you commit: lighting is one of the most critical decisions you can make, and there are ways to go wrong with a good unit by not starting with precautions (I'm starting at 50% and ramping it up slowly, 10% at a go, every few days, until I'm satisfied---and even so my fish are confused and wondering what's going on). Also worth understanding is that, while in the workaday world, red stands for hot and blue stands for cool, blue light is potent in reef lights, and you cannot apply folk wisdom to the lighting choice. Treat blues with respect. Anyway, just a---'my world has changed' moment, for me and the fishes. It's a brand new world of totally adjustable light, in which talking before doing is a good idea, especially if you're adding it to an extant reef. I'll post further when I can see how this is working out. __________________ Sk8r Salinity 1.024-6; alkalinity 8.3-9.3 on KH scale; calcium 420; magnesium 1300, temp 78-80, nitrate .2. Ammonia 0. No filters: lps tank. Alk and cal won't rise if mg is low. Current Tank Info: 105g AquaVim wedge, yellow tang, sailfin blenny,royal gramma, ocellaris clown pair, yellow watchman, 100 microceriths, 25 tiny hermits, a 4" conch, 1" nassarius, recovering from 2 year hiatus with daily water change of 10%.

09/10/2015, 05:44 PM	#2
CStrickland Registered Member Join Date: Jan 2015 Location: New England, U.S. Posts: 4,595	Good luck! Are you running regular intervals and just ramping up intensity, or adding hours over time too? __________________ If you're havin tank problems I feel bad for you, son. I got 99 problems but a fish ain't one Current Tank Info: 3/2016 upgrade to 120g. Chalk bass, melanurus, firefish, starry blenny, canary blenny, lyretail anthias, engineer gobys, kole tang. Softies / LPS / NPS. <3 noob4life <3

09/11/2015, 04:53 AM	#4
Ron Reefman Registered Member Join Date: Jul 2009 Location: Cape Coral, FL Posts: 10,431	Sk8r, welcome to the world of leds! It took my reef about 2 months to really acclimate from 1000 watts of MH and 160 watts of t5 to new leds. But after that the corals are just as healthy and grow just as well. And I love being able to change the colors in the tank so easily. Not to mention the cost saving. But being at the other end of the country, MH heat was harder to take here in SW Florida, so my chillers (2) and home A/C both work a lot less! Look forward to your updates. __________________ The good thing about science is that it's true whether or not you believe in it. (Neil deGrasse Tyson) Visit my build thread http://www.reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?t=2593017

09/11/2015, 05:20 AM	#5
Sugar Magnolia Registered Member Join Date: Feb 2003 Location: Northern VA Posts: 17,691	Go slow with ramping up the intensity of the lights. __________________ Adrienne The only thing to fear is fear itself....and spiders.

09/11/2015, 05:45 AM	#6
gone fishin Registered Member Join Date: Jul 2011 Location: Wyocena Wi Posts: 6,936	Congrats on the move. It took me about 2-3 months to dial in the lights as well. __________________ Tony Current Tank Info: 180gal DT, BM NAC77 skimmer,3 Maxspect razors, Maxspect Gyre 150, 30g QT

09/10/2015, 09:19 PM	#3
Pmj Registered Member Join Date: Jan 2014 Location: Cooper City, FL Posts: 229	Which LEDs did you go with?

09/11/2015, 05:58 AM	#7
shifty51008 12-5 Chiefs record Join Date: Mar 2010 Location: NW Iowa Posts: 10,134	Congrats on the switch, hope you will be very happy with them. I know your tank is mostly lps but if you have any sps can you watch to see how the growth is, ive heard some people say the branches get thinner with leds and such. __________________ 75 gal. mixed DT, 100 gal. sump, 50 gal. fuge, Clownfish breeder

09/11/2015, 06:07 AM	#8
toothybugs In Memoriam Join Date: Aug 2013 Location: The smallest county in Illinois Posts: 1,986	Very cool and congrats I don't miss my ballast either. I took the plunge in March after years of halides and it didn't take me too long to dial them in to where I liked them. I just bumped up the intensity a bit a couple weeks ago and some new SPS is coloring up really nicely.

09/11/2015, 08:08 AM	#9
billdogg Registered Member Join Date: Apr 2008 Location: Grove City, Ohio Posts: 10,806	Congratulations ! A word of caution however. You might want to start at a lower intensity - say 35% and go up from there. LEDS seem to pack a lot of punch. 2 years in and mine are at 65w/45b/45rb (AI Sol blues x 2 for a 120) Hth __________________ I'll try to be nice if you try to be smarter! I can't help that I grow older, but you can't make me grow up! Current Tank Info: 120 mixed reef with 40b sump, RO 150 skimmer, AI Sol Blue x 2, and a 60g Frag Tank with 100g rubbermaid sump. 2 x Kessil A360w lights, BM curve 5 skimmer

09/11/2015, 01:04 PM	#10
Sk8r RC Mod Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: Spokane WA Posts: 34,628 Blog Entries: 55	Heard and understood. I'm running one Radion Pro in a 105 gallon very deep wedge, and the Pro is the only one I've found that's capable of reaching a 30-36" depth. Because it is a wedge bow tank, it covers well. I'll knock that back a bit. I'm nearly starting over with the reef: I traded off all my coral because of a list of changes ---and because of the fact I realized my light wasn't at all up to the deeper tank, and am down to one piece, which is deep, so I am watching it closely. __________________ Sk8r Salinity 1.024-6; alkalinity 8.3-9.3 on KH scale; calcium 420; magnesium 1300, temp 78-80, nitrate .2. Ammonia 0. No filters: lps tank. Alk and cal won't rise if mg is low. Current Tank Info: 105g AquaVim wedge, yellow tang, sailfin blenny,royal gramma, ocellaris clown pair, yellow watchman, 100 microceriths, 25 tiny hermits, a 4" conch, 1" nassarius, recovering from 2 year hiatus with daily water change of 10%.

09/11/2015, 01:09 PM	#11
3dees Registered Member Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: Chicago burbs Posts: 793	as much as I love the look of MH, I would never have them instead of LED's. changing bulbs often and dealing with the heat they produce. and then there's the extra cost of electricity. I just don't see any advantages to MH.

09/11/2015, 06:59 PM	#12
Sk8r RC Mod Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: Spokane WA Posts: 34,628 Blog Entries: 55	My tank is primarily lps, once I get it up and going. I'll have more data in about six months. Right now I'm just trying to get started out---and there's a lot to learn. __________________ Sk8r Salinity 1.024-6; alkalinity 8.3-9.3 on KH scale; calcium 420; magnesium 1300, temp 78-80, nitrate .2. Ammonia 0. No filters: lps tank. Alk and cal won't rise if mg is low. Current Tank Info: 105g AquaVim wedge, yellow tang, sailfin blenny,royal gramma, ocellaris clown pair, yellow watchman, 100 microceriths, 25 tiny hermits, a 4" conch, 1" nassarius, recovering from 2 year hiatus with daily water change of 10%.

09/14/2015, 11:04 AM	#13
Xxero Registered Member Join Date: Apr 2015 Location: Oklahoma City Posts: 1,054	Sk8r, did the switch over cause any odd behaviors in your fish? And if so, in what ways? Are they still acting odd or are they beginning to get used to things now? ThanX! __________________ "You Can Lead A Gift Horse To Water... But You Can't Make Him Look In Your Mouth." Current Tank Info: 65g Mixed Reef Display - 15g Macro Algae/Refugium - 40b Sump

09/14/2015, 11:09 AM	#14
Sk8r RC Mod Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: Spokane WA Posts: 34,628 Blog Entries: 55	They were spooked, and probably feeling the blues. If I feed with the strong blues on, they're not anxious to go up after the food---so I'm gathering it's a bit intense for them. They are, however, more relaxed at the startup and shutdown---the long blue twilight seems friendly to them, and I'm not seeing the stress they used to show around lights-out. They are settling now, but at brightest, they spend a bit of time in their shelters. (Damsel tank: everybody has a hole.] The coral, which had been sad in the old inadequate lights, is starting to puff up a bit. __________________ Sk8r Salinity 1.024-6; alkalinity 8.3-9.3 on KH scale; calcium 420; magnesium 1300, temp 78-80, nitrate .2. Ammonia 0. No filters: lps tank. Alk and cal won't rise if mg is low. Current Tank Info: 105g AquaVim wedge, yellow tang, sailfin blenny,royal gramma, ocellaris clown pair, yellow watchman, 100 microceriths, 25 tiny hermits, a 4" conch, 1" nassarius, recovering from 2 year hiatus with daily water change of 10%.

09/14/2015, 11:20 AM	#15
Xxero Registered Member Join Date: Apr 2015 Location: Oklahoma City Posts: 1,054	Ah, I see. I increased my lighting this past Friday and it seemed to trip my Anthias out a little. She started hanging out in her sleeping spot over the weekend (which she never does), and is just now starting to venture out more. I was thinking it might be the lighting increase, so I was wondering if you experienced any of that as well. I feel better now. GL! __________________ "You Can Lead A Gift Horse To Water... But You Can't Make Him Look In Your Mouth." Current Tank Info: 65g Mixed Reef Display - 15g Macro Algae/Refugium - 40b Sump

09/14/2015, 12:17 PM	#16
Sk8r RC Mod Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: Spokane WA Posts: 34,628 Blog Entries: 55	Yes: we learn all our lives that red is hot and blue is cool, but in marine, blues go deep and can be quite intense. __________________ Sk8r Salinity 1.024-6; alkalinity 8.3-9.3 on KH scale; calcium 420; magnesium 1300, temp 78-80, nitrate .2. Ammonia 0. No filters: lps tank. Alk and cal won't rise if mg is low. Current Tank Info: 105g AquaVim wedge, yellow tang, sailfin blenny,royal gramma, ocellaris clown pair, yellow watchman, 100 microceriths, 25 tiny hermits, a 4" conch, 1" nassarius, recovering from 2 year hiatus with daily water change of 10%.

09/14/2015, 12:50 PM	#17
nuxx RC Sponsor Join Date: Jan 2014 Location: Austin, Tx Posts: 3,990	Temp in the house drop 10 degrees? __________________ Peter TankStop - Fish and Coral 470G Display - Build Thread Current Tank Info: Retired - 470 Gallon Mixed Reef (120x29x31")

09/14/2015, 01:00 PM	#18
cloak Moved On Join Date: Jul 2000 Location: Stockton, CA Posts: 14,854	Just out of curiosity, does that Radion Pro create that "disco effect" on the bottom of the tank, or is it more like a Kessil A360, kind of white to blue or vice versa? I'm not too familiar with LED's so that's why I'm asking.

09/14/2015, 01:56 PM	#19
Sk8r RC Mod Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: Spokane WA Posts: 34,628 Blog Entries: 55	If by disco effect you mean color spots, I have a wedge tank, not a square, and setup has no specific question for 'I have only 3 sides,' so I just gave everything as 36x36 widex36 deep I see a few short stripes of red and blue on my back wall, which is a massive overflow box mottled with coralline and such---a pretty effect there. On the rock and sand, no: I have my light at the recommended height. There is also something during setup that they ask your tank shape and depth, and mine is over 30" deep, which is why I got the Radion Pro, which actually can handle that depth. I can see where that 'depth' question might impact how the lights worked on the sand. __________________ Sk8r Salinity 1.024-6; alkalinity 8.3-9.3 on KH scale; calcium 420; magnesium 1300, temp 78-80, nitrate .2. Ammonia 0. No filters: lps tank. Alk and cal won't rise if mg is low. Current Tank Info: 105g AquaVim wedge, yellow tang, sailfin blenny,royal gramma, ocellaris clown pair, yellow watchman, 100 microceriths, 25 tiny hermits, a 4" conch, 1" nassarius, recovering from 2 year hiatus with daily water change of 10%.

09/14/2015, 02:32 PM	#20
Sk8r RC Mod Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: Spokane WA Posts: 34,628 Blog Entries: 55	Mind, I've only used these a week. But I would say if you're starting out---these are definitely a decent route. Back in 2004, I paid big for a Metal Halide kit and then found out the ballasts, which didn't come with them, were just as spendy. I think my total outlay in 2004 dollars was 800.00 for a single 250 watt metal halide with accompanying HO actinic for color balance; and 2 ballasts, which are pretty power-hungry. And I had to replace one 50.00 bulb and two actinics every 8 months. The LEDs right now are definitely worth considering as a start-up option: just be sure what you get is coral-capable. The ones I have come with a number of preset routines that you can then modify via your computer, and you don't need a college degree in physics or electronics or marine biology to set them up. I'm real satisfied with one of the routines, which delivers a pretty and changing range of blues, whites, purples during the day and moonlight for a while at night, and the corals seem to be responding positively. __________________ Sk8r Salinity 1.024-6; alkalinity 8.3-9.3 on KH scale; calcium 420; magnesium 1300, temp 78-80, nitrate .2. Ammonia 0. No filters: lps tank. Alk and cal won't rise if mg is low. Current Tank Info: 105g AquaVim wedge, yellow tang, sailfin blenny,royal gramma, ocellaris clown pair, yellow watchman, 100 microceriths, 25 tiny hermits, a 4" conch, 1" nassarius, recovering from 2 year hiatus with daily water change of 10%.

09/14/2015, 07:22 PM	#21
toothybugs In Memoriam Join Date: Aug 2013 Location: The smallest county in Illinois Posts: 1,986	I had a very similar start-up experience.

09/15/2015, 10:23 AM	#23
Sk8r RC Mod Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: Spokane WA Posts: 34,628 Blog Entries: 55	I'm using the 'radiant' one...I think it may be the second in the sequence. I tinkered with it a little trying to get the 'storms and clouds' to operate, and they tell me you have to save every 'point' on the graph separately, so I need to go back in and do that, but it's producing beautiful colors---does the intense blue thing one morning and one evening, but gradates up to blue white and down to violets. It's also done in the persistent cyano patch, a side bennie. __________________ Sk8r Salinity 1.024-6; alkalinity 8.3-9.3 on KH scale; calcium 420; magnesium 1300, temp 78-80, nitrate .2. Ammonia 0. No filters: lps tank. Alk and cal won't rise if mg is low. Current Tank Info: 105g AquaVim wedge, yellow tang, sailfin blenny,royal gramma, ocellaris clown pair, yellow watchman, 100 microceriths, 25 tiny hermits, a 4" conch, 1" nassarius, recovering from 2 year hiatus with daily water change of 10%.