fish

[out]

I'm new to saltwater & only have fish. I want to see how I do then i'll look to get into reef. First I've had my tank since Sept 1. I add fish about three weeks ago. My question is two weeks ago to date I add a raccoon butterfly to my tank my water levels was great. Well a week later the raccoon showed injury to its side this was sat night- sun I checked in on it it seemed to progress, and by mon afternoon it was gone (fish). I took a pic to the shop that sold it to me and he has no idea what it was. I also have a hippo tang in my tank, well tonight it also is showing signs of disease he is eating & swimming around the tank. Talked to the shop owner again and he has no idea of what is going own with my tank (my water is good). I have a dogface puffer, porcupine puffer, coral beauty, and a auriga butterfly. All of them look good. Does anyone have any ideas of what could be going on. I brought them all from the same shop

Thanks,
Out

[Foooz]

Out - first i am just getting started as well so my advice should be validated. Need to provide info on your tank; size, amount of live rock, filtration system. Also provide water parameters for your tank. From a very unqualified perspective I would say a tank that is 6 weeks old and has 6 fish (1 deceased now), I would guess your bio load is higher than your filtration capability. This is a complete guess though. What kind of water are you using for topping off, for water changes. Did you QT your fish and how?
Foooz

[out]

I have 50 pds of live rock with a sump and bio balls. My salt level is 1.019, ammonia & nitrites is undetectable. Before adding any fish the shop owner always check my water levels. I've gotten all of my equipment from him He's good. He can't figure it out

[out]

using a kold ster-il for my water

[CStrickland]

How many gallons is your tank, or what are the dimensions for height, width, and depth?

[out]

125 gal

[out]

started adding meds to my tank today, also put a uv-sterilizer on, but that's not going to help once the fish is infected

[out]

or yesterday

[Taahirs]

What meds did you add??

Most meds can't be used in a main tank.

[out]

melafix

[out]

for marine fish

[CStrickland]

Do you see aggression when you feed, or when the lights go out and everyone darts to their caves?
50# isn't much rock, they may fight over sleeping places because real estate is scarce

[out]

no actually on the aggression. the hippo is the aggressor if anyone is

[billdogg]

Your tank is now about 6 weeks old, so it therefore is barely cycled. You tell us your water is "good" but without giving actual numbers, "good" is meaningless. What are your actual levels for Ammonia, Nitrite, Nitrate, pH. Your salinity is low by any standards at 1.019. It should be close to 1.025.

At this point, you should have 1 or 2 fairly hardy fish, and should be adding no more than 1 every week or so. You don't mention quarantining your new additions, so I can only guess that you are adding them straight into the display tank. That is a huge mistake - you will be introducing any and all pathogens to your system. IME, melafix, even when used in a proper QT/Hospital tank, is pretty much useless.

Your tank is marginally sized for at least some of the fish you have, even if it had been cycled properly, and some of the fish you have are, at best, difficult even for those more experienced in the hobby.

Your LFS is telling you what you want to hear because they want to sell you more fish. Please stop, read the stickies at the top of this forum, ask more questions, and above all else, SLOW DOWN.

Nothing good happens fast in this hobby.

[ericarenee]

I Agree with billdogg. The fish you have especially that hippo tang should not have been introduced to a newly setup tank.. You should have at least 6 months with no Issues before doing so.QT Tank on these fish are def a must.They are parasite magnets and Do not do well in anything less then a perfect environment for them.

I would have a talk with that Person at the local fish store and ask them WHY Are they selling a new to saltwater tanks Expert only fish.......
For that size tank a pair of clowns would have made a good starter fish . There are others as well...

Slow and steady with QT Tank is best.

[stingeragent]

I agree with the 2 above posts as well as CS's. Fish were added way too fast. As pointed out your salinity is too low. You need to slowly raise it over several weeks to at least 1.023 but 1.025 or 1.026 would be better. 50 lbs of rock in a barely cycled 125 is not nearly enough with that fish load. If you only had a couple small fish like clowns or something it would be ok. Also, you need to setup a quarantine. Medication should not be dosed directly to your display. Depending on what it is it can affect the bacteria in your tank, the sand, live rock, inverts, etc. You said the first fish that died looked like it had an injury, and then said the 2nd fish is showing signs of disease. That's two different things. Also, by signs of disease, what do you mean? Little white dots everywhere or something similar? Red inflamed gills? Also, when asking for help on here , especially if its a question about a sick fish, saying your water is good and the LFS tested it kind of defeats the purpose of getting advice. You should at the minimum post your salinity, temp, ammonia, nitrate, nitrite for a fish only tank. Also, you have a decently sized tank for someone new to SW. Having to fix fish issues on larger tanks can be more expensive and also more time consuming, so it's best to do it right the first time. Not trying to sound mean, but it's almost impossible to help someone when it comes to saltwater if all you post is that 1 fish died, 1 looks diseased, my water is good, LFS said so, why are my fish sick?

Edit: As another poster mentioned, you also need to slow WAY down, or this hobby is gonna end poorly for you. Getting a nice pretty tank full of fish is awesome, but you have to take the proper steps to get there, and dumping in 6 fish at once isn't the proper way. A pic of your fish that looks diseased would help. If it has small white dots/bumps on it, it is most likely ich. If that is the case, all the other fish are now infected.

[Sk8r]

Definitely: you've gotten this far, but there are some major problems.

For starters, read that SETTING UP sticky above, which is a FAQ plus things you won't expect until you meet them. Don't buy any more fish until you have the tank water ready to receive them, and it is not, now, in that condition. I hate to tell you, but fish are actually the hard part, as far as getting started with healthy fish and keeping the water ok for them. They are wild caught mostly, and come in with parasites and disease that has to be handled before they are ok in the tank. The SETTING UP file will help, but believe me, mistakes happen in this complex hobby, and you'll get through this in good order. Let's just start with some precise info, and if you don't know where to get the info, you need some tests---a refractometer for salt level, an autotopoff to keep it there, a test for nitrate, one for ammonia, a bottle of Prime to stop ammonia, and a test for alkalinity. You DO need a little side tank, perfectly plain, to keep your fish in until they have passed their quarantine and physical, no kidding.

[out]

thanks all for responding to my post, but let me clarify certain things that was brought up. One-the shop that is selling me my fish. He's not just selling me fish just to be selling me fish also the fish are quarantined before they are introduced to my tank. Non of my fish were added all at the same time. I brought one then waited a week or so then added another. Also if you had read all my post you would have seen that I gave my water parameters. (salinity-1.019-Nitrite & ammonia 0ppm, nitrate 25ppm-ph-8.0,temp-77) I also add copper. I haven't taken offence to anything that has been said, but (billdogg) I'm already older. Just trying to learn this hobby I watch a lot of (brstv) as I see on many of your post your tank info. And one other thing don't have the money to move too fast (Lol)


salinity-1.019-Nitrite & ammonia 0ppm, nitrate 25ppm-ph-8.2,temp-77.

Current tank info-125gal FOWLR 50pds LR, sump/w bio-balls, uv-sterilizer. Fish: dogface puffer, porcupine puffer, coral beauty, aurgia butterfly

[Spacekitty]

Adding copper to the DT probably isn't the best idea ever. You no longer will have the ability to add any inverts like shrimp or corals because they are very sensitive to it and they will kill it. If you want to keep it fish only forever, its not AS bad, but some fish are sensitive to copper as well. Even if you stop adding it, it will likely be in your live rock forever. Normally people will only do copper in a QT when it is needed to treat something like ich.

Edit: Also, how long are they quarantined for? And what is your QT process?

[Reef Frog]

If you stop adding copper right now & replace the live rock & sand, along with some water changes & filtration with a copper absorbant, the chances chances of having a successful reef tank in the future are good.

[Sk8r]

PolyFilter can absorb copper over time---not cheap, but effective.

[CStrickland]

I think that after treating with copper, something like cuprisorb is the appropriate adsorbant http://www.marinedepot.com/Seachem_L...FMCHCR-vi.html
it can take on a lot of copper, and can be regenerated too.
polyfilter is good for removing mystery issues though. I keep some on hand just in case.

ETA: the issue with copper is that it is pretty effective at treating certain parasites, and for a long time it was the only treatment we had, so it's pretty common. Unfortunately, it is really hard on all the other animals in the tank, so coral and snails and just about everything but the fish (some fish too). And, it soaks into the rocks and sand so that they release it later. The parasite treatment is a couple parts copper per million parts water, but it only takes a few parts per billion to wreck coral. For those reasons, even treating copper in QT is kinda old school, and nobody adds it to the DT.
But, if you think about what the fish go through to get to us, is surprising they aren't in worse shape. Like, its a wild animal taken from the ocean and shipped halfway around the world, then mixed in with a whole bunch of other animals in an Ellis Island-type warehouse, before it even gets to the shop. Plus, larger fish are often returned to the shop after someone gave up on them, so that's not working in your favor. That's why you have to be really cautious with diseases, especially when you are adding to a tank that's doing ok b/c it only takes one patient zero to knock out your whole investment.

Here is a good website to look up how much tank different fish need, and whether they are good choices for a beginner or more difficult (a lot of fish are picky eaters, or just don't tend to thrive in new tanks, it's the whole wild animal thing again - some don't domesticate as easy). It also lists fish by whether they are reef-safe (not prone to eat coral) and how big they will get etc. http://www.liveaquaria.com/

[out]

thanks cstrickland & sk8r. I do look at liveaquaria during research on fish before purchase. Also i'm not ready for reef yet just trying to get my feet wet with f/o, but I do know once i'm ready that I have to change my live rock & sand because of the cooper. I do a lot of research also brstv.





salinity-1.019-Nitrite & ammonia 0ppm, nitrate 25ppm-ph-8.2,temp-77.

Current tank info-125gal FOWLR 50pds LR, sump/w bio-balls, uv-sterilizer. Fish: dogface puffer, porcupine puffer, coral beauty, aurgia butterfly

[CStrickland]

Well, the obvious thing would be aggression, but if you still have the pic that you took to the store it wouldn't hurt to post it here to be sure. Uronemea can kill fast and leaves red sores that might look like an injury, also a pic of the sick fish too. Since depending what is wrong, the copper could be weakening them, like you need the right meds for the right disease. Also, I think you can dim the lights and spoil them with food a little bit to keep their immune systems up. When fish are fat and relaxed they recover muuuch better. Maybe throw in a few chunks of PVC to make sure everyone has a few choices for hiding places if you don't want to add rocks for that?