Dinoflagellates in a new-ish tank, Should I worry?

[meverha1]

110 gallon tank with 40 gallon sump. It's about 2 months old and was cycled using Red Sea's "Reef Mature" program so I've been dosing NoPox since day 1.

PH: 8.11 (early morning, expect it to rise a bit when lights come on)
Ammonia: 0
Nitrite: 0
Nitrate: less than 5 ppm
Ca: 480
Alk: 10
Phosphate: Don't currently have a test kit but running GFO
Carbon: Rox .08 in areactor

Following Echotech's Coral Lab program for Soft/LPS corals

I had some cyano issues so last week I did a round of Chemiclean and everything cleared up. Now it seems like I may have a dino outbreak.

Since the tank is relatively new is this something I should be worried about or is it a "normal" part of the post-cycle of a newer tank? Should I go full blackout for 48 hours or just wait it out?

Also, I've heard that Hydrogen Peroxide helps but I have a cleaner shrimp in the tank and I don't want to kill him. Thoughts?

[Preble]

Are you sure it's Dino, and not diatoms?
If you had some sort of spike it could have had a mini cycle
Do you have a picture?


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[Preble]

And how many hours do you run your lights a day?


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[mr9iron]

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[scooter31707]

If it is dinos, then I recommend start treating now while it is in the early stages. Dinos can take over a tank quickly.

[meverha1]

Originally Posted by Preble

Are you sure it's Dino, and not diatoms?
If you had some sort of spike it could have had a mini cycle
Do you have a picture?


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I don't have a picture handy, sorry.

I run my lights roughly 8 hours per day with 1 hour ramp up and ramp down. There's some low level moonlighting for a few hours after that but that's only for viewing the tank. I'm using Radion LEDS and they are currently on acclimation mode working their way up to full strength. They are probably around 70% power now. I'm following Ecotech's Coral Lab protocol for Soft/LPS corals

I changed out both my carbon and my GFO on Saturday when the Chemiclean treatment was complete.

I suppose it could be diatoms but the slightly snotty texture makes me think it could be Dinos. There are some bubbles too but I've heard that diatoms can get those.

No spike that I know of and only one of my (two) tanks has this issue. Same RODI water source, same salt, same chemicals, etc... so if it is dinos I'm not sure where they came from unless they hitchhiked on a piece of coral and I dip all of that.

I vaguely remember something similar in my other thank right after it cycled but it couldn't have been much and must not have lasted long or I would definitely remember it.

Also, it's only in my display tank. No signs of it in my sump or fuge.

The Chemiclean I ran for the Cyano didn't seem to affect it at all.


What's the standard protocol? Lights out for 48 hours? I can't really dose Hydrogen Peroxide because of the shrimp, unless 1 ml per gallon is so low that it won't hurt it.

I'm open to suggestions

[Martin Kuhn]

Hm, i'm not a fan of chemiclean or other stuff like that. It to often ruins tanks biology more than it helps

Show us a picture at good light conditions. This is fine for a first guess if you might have infected your tank with dinoflagellates.




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[Preble]

Yeah a good picture will be more useful


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[reef thief]

I just want to do a quick drive by and request a good pic.....yeah that be great...

[meverha1]

I'll do my best to get a pic tomorrow

[2smokes]

This is what you get when you use chemi clean and nopox from day one...Instead of letting the nature to follow its natural course,diatoms,cyano GHA and at last bacteria or macroalgae when the tank is stable .Since its just a 2 months old tank i would prefer to start from zero again.The nopox acts as a carbon source and feeds the cyano and the dynoflagelagelates,stop using it and let the cyano to dissapear on its own.It will take a while for a cyano bloom to dissapear and be changed with GHA but better wait than sorry.This is a hobby that will test your patience.I would start again from zero because that way ,it will take less time to become stable than it is now.Sell or donatte the shrimp then start again.I would not even use the same rocks,i would prefer to buy new ones.

[meverha1]

Despite asking multiple times no one has actually answered my question, which is how do I deal with this dino outbreak.

And no, starting over isn't even a consideration right now. It's not going to happen.

[Ebone]

Yet there is still no confirmation it is dinos and not diatoms, which are a normal new tank blues... if I had Dinos and was sure I would with out a doubt restart... at least as early on as you are... also I feel it is too early to be treating a tank with every chemical under the sun... some things just need to run their course... fast solutions lead to bigger problems, this is a slow hobby

[meverha1]

No the best picture but you can see a bit of what I'm talking about on the rock. It's somewhat slimy looking with some tendrils coming off of it. Also, take note of my photogenic jawfish in the background

[2smokes]

Looks like diatoms and cyano but the picture isnt good enough.Ciano also makes long tendrils but less than the dynoflagelates and much longer.Let it dissapear on its own.The cyano bloom will be replaced by a green hair algae bloom and after a while the GHA will dissapear on its own also.This cycle,if you interrupt it ,then you will always have problems and the aquarium will never be stable .If it botthers corals then clean it (cyano or GHA) only around the corals and in the rest of the aquarium let the nature to follow its course.

[CStrickland]

Originally Posted by meverha1

Despite asking multiple times no one has actually answered my question, which is how do I deal with this dino outbreak.

And no, starting over isn't even a consideration right now. It's not going to happen.

Here's your answer for dealing with dinos http://www.reefcentral.com/forums/sh....php?t=2307000 a quick skim of the first hundred pages or so should reveal why people are trying to help you eliminate other possible issues that you'd much rather have.

Good luck!

[Ebone]

Originally Posted by CStrickland

Here's your answer for dealing with dinos http://www.reefcentral.com/forums/sh....php?t=2307000 a quick skim of the first hundred pages or so should reveal why people are trying to help you eliminate other possible issues that you'd much rather have.

Good luck!

like!

[meverha1]

Originally Posted by 2smokes

Looks like diatoms and cyano but the picture isnt good enough.Ciano also makes long tendrils but less than the dynoflagelates and much longer.Let it dissapear on its own.The cyano bloom will be replaced by a green hair algae bloom and after a while the GHA will dissapear on its own also.This cycle,if you interrupt it ,then you will always have problems and the aquarium will never be stable .If it botthers corals then clean it (cyano or GHA) only around the corals and in the rest of the aquarium let the nature to follow its course.

That's likely what's happening as I've seen some hair algae on the uppermost rocks in the tank.

[2smokes]

If you have GHA ,then dont kill it except if its growing on a coral.Green hair algae is able to take soo much nutrients that it will starve the cyano.Its basically a cyano vs GHA battle that is going to happen and you wish GHA to win.If you kill the GHA then the cyano will take its place until new GHA appears.Cyano is much worse than GHA so consider yourself lucky if GHA has started to grow as it will take the cyano place in the microenviroment .After a while the GHA will dissapear on its own and after that you will have an established aquarium.I apologise i told you to restart without seeing a picture.You can keep the setup and go on but my advice is dont nuke everything that blooms in the aquarium because that will make the process slower and otther ,,plague ,,will take the place of the one that makes you trouble.And NOPOX feeds cyano with carbon,its wise to stop dosing it because bacteria has no chance to beat cyano or GHA .Bacteria needs nitrates and in the absence of nitrates it cant eat phosphates no matter how much carbon you dose(the nopox).Cyano and GHA can live on phosphates without needing nitrates like bacteria does.Lowering the phosphates in the water by using GFO or an algae srcubber will also dont work to fix your problem because the rocks are leaking phosphates and even with zero phosphates in the water ,the cyano and GHA will still thrive by eating the phosphates that are embedded in the rock and sand.Ower time your rocks will be ,,cemented,, with a thin layer of calcium from the water and the phosphates will be locked into the stone .It takes up to a year and a half to achieve this and after that you wont have problems with cyano or GHA blooms because they wont have the phosphates that are embeded in the rock to feed.The phosphates that are in the rock are inorganic and are linked by calcium.They dont come from fresh dead matter and even if you wash the stones with acid you will still have rock thats releasing phosphates.If you want to speed up the ,,cementing,, of the rocks with calcium and to get rid of all the plagues(cyano and GHA) you could keep a stable and higher ph .At lower ph because of the high level co2 from inside our houses the rock will melt a litle on the surface relasing not only calcium but also the phosphates that are bonded by calcium.Even after 5 years of having an aquarium,if you have a perriod where the ph get too low then the rock will melt that protective thin layer of calcium and will start to leak phosphates again feeding cyano and GHA blooms.