180g imploding....

TokiHacker · 06/08/2017, 08:16 AM

So... my 180 has been going strong. Tested params yesterday and the following

salinity 1.026
Ph 8.2
A 0
Ni 0
Na 10
Ca 520
Mg 1500
Alk 9

Then... I wake up this morning with the skimmer going crazy and lost my starry blenny 2 clown fish and coral beauty and everything else isn't looking great...

What happened?

Only thing I have added is NoPox (two days ago) stability yesterday and stresscoat (which I can assume is why the skimmer is going off the chain)

but... with that what is killing the fish and making coral look awful?

billdogg · 06/08/2017, 08:25 AM

I'd be interested in your parameters today.

Also - with your parameters where they were yesterday, why were you adding anything at all?

All it takes is one thing to start going south and then it can quickly become a cascade of issues.

Carbon and water changes at this point regardless of what todays testing shows would be a good idea IMO

TokiHacker · 06/08/2017, 08:27 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by billdogg

I'd be interested in your parameters today.

Also - with your parameters where they were yesterday, why were you adding anything at all?

All it takes is one thing to start going south and then it can quickly become a cascade of issues.

Carbon and water changes at this point regardless of what todays testing shows would be a good idea IMO

Already put carbon in and had to go to work so wasn't able to change water... by the time I checked I was already pretty much walking out the door. Trying to see if I can jump ship today and get home.

cincyjim · 06/08/2017, 08:48 AM

Do you use a UV sterilizer? I ask because when I used Stress Coat with the UV sterilizer, I had some very bad reactions. I'm not sure why they didn't get along with each other but my parameters were greatly affected by the interaction between the two.

TokiHacker · 06/08/2017, 08:57 AM

No iv sterilizer

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

TokiHacker · 06/08/2017, 09:16 AM

It is really quite frustrating.... just kinda makes you want to quit some times...

TokiHacker · 06/08/2017, 09:17 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by billdogg

I'd be interested in your parameters today.

Also - with your parameters where they were yesterday, why were you adding anything at all?

All it takes is one thing to start going south and then it can quickly become a cascade of issues.

Carbon and water changes at this point regardless of what todays testing shows would be a good idea IMO

The reasoning for the stability was I have always done it. When a WC is done had a cap of stability and stresscoat. Has never caused any issues until this time.

sik_z33 · 06/08/2017, 09:21 AM

How old is the system?

mcgyvr · 06/08/2017, 09:32 AM

Why did you add stresscoat?

I haven't used that crap since I thought I needed to with my first goldfish tank when I was 4.. API rode that one all the way to the bank..

and are you dosing? Your alk is lower than what it could/should be with cal/mag being top of the range.. (None of that is necessarily bad) but I'd expect alk to be at the higher end too if it was just from the salt mix..

ReeferNoob4ever · 06/08/2017, 10:07 AM

Anything make its way into your tank from the outside air? Like an AC vent blowing on it that might have pulled in some chemicals or something?

afish70 · 06/08/2017, 10:49 AM

Did you check your heater? I have read people having similar situations to find out the heater was wacked out and stuck on heat or the exact opposite.

GimpyFin · 06/08/2017, 12:46 PM

I'm guessing the cocktail of nopox, stresscoat, and stability is what caused everything to go south. I don't use them, but I know Red Sea warns against using any chemical absorbers/neutralizers with nopox (Like stress coat.) Any particular reason for using them? Are you using tap water?

Sk8r · 06/08/2017, 03:39 PM

I would agree. Rather than use stresscoat, keep your alkalinity about 8.3 and your salinity stable. Fish have natural defenses if given half a chance, so they don't need the stresscoat unless there's something bad going on. Generally, they produce a good slime coat all on their own.

Tripod1404 · 06/08/2017, 03:46 PM

Stress coat contain Aloe Vera extract ,so it is a carbon source. Mixing that with nopox might have caused an overdose of carbon which would result in bacteria bloom. If this is the case, bacteria would consume the oxygen and fish would suffocate. It would also make the skimmer go crazy.

homer1475 · 06/08/2017, 03:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tripod1404

Stress coat contain Aloe Vera extract ,so it is a carbon source. Mixing that with nopox might have caused an overdose of carbon which would result in bacteria bloom. If this is the case, bacteria would consume the oxygen and fish would suffocate. It would also make the skimmer go crazy.

THIS!

Was just going to post the same exact thing.

billdogg · 06/08/2017, 06:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tripod1404

Stress coat contain Aloe Vera extract ,so it is a carbon source. Mixing that with nopox might have caused an overdose of carbon which would result in bacteria bloom. If this is the case, bacteria would consume the oxygen and fish would suffocate. It would also make the skimmer go crazy.

Quote:

Originally Posted by homer1475

THIS!

Was just going to post the same exact thing.

Thanks for the information! I suspected something along those lines - thanks for confirming.

monkeysee1 · 06/08/2017, 06:33 PM

Quote:

I'm guessing the cocktail of nopox, stresscoat, and stability is what caused everything to go south.

Nailed it.
Wonder what posessed Toki to put all that in his tank to begin with. His parameters were fine. Calcium and Magnesium were a bit high, but okay (though his calcium level could, over time, end up clogging his piping because of precipitate buildup.

TokiHacker · 06/09/2017, 12:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by monkeysee1

Nailed it.
Wonder what posessed Toki to put all that in his tank to begin with. His parameters were fine. Calcium and Magnesium were a bit high, but okay (though his calcium level could, over time, end up clogging his piping because of precipitate buildup.

The reasoning behind the stresscoat was because there was a Singapore angel that came out of quarantine that kinda got beat up a little... was under the assumption that would help with keeping it alive since I could not catch him.

TokiHacker · 06/09/2017, 12:26 PM

An nopox to lower the nitrates to 5ppm and stability because I just always have.... maybe being a creature of habit isn't always the best thing...

Sounds Fishy · 06/10/2017, 09:31 AM

Has your Singapore angel survived?I hope so,because they really are delicate,and very nice fish.Two things I know about stress coat.The reason it is supposed to work is because it encourages the slime on fish to thicken,however,in order to achieve this the product irritates the fishs' outer coat ( thus stimulating the slime to grow to protect the fish from the product you added).That seems counter productive.
Also,your skimmer just removes it from the water,anyway.So why bother... No pox is a good product.
Sounds maybe you love you fish so much you tried to give them every oppourtunity at a good life by adding a few things that are supposed to help keep everything in good condition,however,sometimes( and in hind sight), just doing regular water changes is the best solution.

TokiHacker · 06/13/2017, 12:42 PM

sadly no... and I lost my blue jaw trigger...

crushing.... but going to do some more water changes and keep at it.

jalisco · 06/14/2017, 02:18 AM

Sorry for your loss.

Coralfuture · 06/15/2017, 10:46 PM

Sorry to hear about the losses I hope you can salvage what's left

06/08/2017, 08:16 AM	#1
TokiHacker Registered Member Join Date: Jan 2017 Location: Mobile, Alabama Posts: 549	180g imploding.... So... my 180 has been going strong. Tested params yesterday and the following salinity 1.026 Ph 8.2 A 0 Ni 0 Na 10 Ca 520 Mg 1500 Alk 9 Then... I wake up this morning with the skimmer going crazy and lost my starry blenny 2 clown fish and coral beauty and everything else isn't looking great... What happened? Only thing I have added is NoPox (two days ago) stability yesterday and stresscoat (which I can assume is why the skimmer is going off the chain) but... with that what is killing the fish and making coral look awful? __________________ 200 GAL Mixed Reef Build \| 20GAL JBJ Frag Tank \| 29GAL Chiragra Mantis Shrimp Tank

06/08/2017, 08:25 AM	#2
billdogg Registered Member Join Date: Apr 2008 Location: Grove City, Ohio Posts: 10,806	I'd be interested in your parameters today. Also - with your parameters where they were yesterday, why were you adding anything at all? All it takes is one thing to start going south and then it can quickly become a cascade of issues. Carbon and water changes at this point regardless of what todays testing shows would be a good idea IMO __________________ I'll try to be nice if you try to be smarter! I can't help that I grow older, but you can't make me grow up! Current Tank Info: 120 mixed reef with 40b sump, RO 150 skimmer, AI Sol Blue x 2, and a 60g Frag Tank with 100g rubbermaid sump. 2 x Kessil A360w lights, BM curve 5 skimmer

06/08/2017, 08:48 AM	#4
cincyjim Registered Member Join Date: Sep 2011 Location: Northern Virginia Posts: 1,147	Do you use a UV sterilizer? I ask because when I used Stress Coat with the UV sterilizer, I had some very bad reactions. I'm not sure why they didn't get along with each other but my parameters were greatly affected by the interaction between the two. __________________ Jim Current Tank Info: SCA 150G, 5 inch sand bed, 2 Tunze 6095s, ReefBreeders v2+ 50" with 2 all Blue Reefbrites, and Continuous Water Change System

06/08/2017, 08:57 AM	#5
TokiHacker Registered Member Join Date: Jan 2017 Location: Mobile, Alabama Posts: 549	No iv sterilizer Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk __________________ 200 GAL Mixed Reef Build \| 20GAL JBJ Frag Tank \| 29GAL Chiragra Mantis Shrimp Tank

06/08/2017, 09:16 AM	#6
TokiHacker Registered Member Join Date: Jan 2017 Location: Mobile, Alabama Posts: 549	It is really quite frustrating.... just kinda makes you want to quit some times... __________________ 200 GAL Mixed Reef Build \| 20GAL JBJ Frag Tank \| 29GAL Chiragra Mantis Shrimp Tank

06/08/2017, 09:21 AM	#8
sik_z33 Registered Member Join Date: Dec 2012 Location: Boynton Beach, FL Posts: 48	How old is the system?

06/08/2017, 09:32 AM	#9
mcgyvr Registered Member Join Date: Sep 2003 Location: North Carolina Posts: 20,050	Why did you add stresscoat? I haven't used that crap since I thought I needed to with my first goldfish tank when I was 4.. API rode that one all the way to the bank.. and are you dosing? Your alk is lower than what it could/should be with cal/mag being top of the range.. (None of that is necessarily bad) but I'd expect alk to be at the higher end too if it was just from the salt mix.. __________________ Who me?

06/08/2017, 10:07 AM	#10
ReeferNoob4ever Registered Member Join Date: Mar 2017 Location: NM Posts: 523	Anything make its way into your tank from the outside air? Like an AC vent blowing on it that might have pulled in some chemicals or something? __________________ Get a life! Current Tank Info: 20gL mixed reef, 10g mixed reef w/nem & clown, 5g NPS & harlequin

06/08/2017, 10:49 AM	#11
afish70 Registered Member Join Date: Jan 2008 Location: Tampa Posts: 688	Did you check your heater? I have read people having similar situations to find out the heater was wacked out and stuck on heat or the exact opposite.

06/08/2017, 12:46 PM	#12
GimpyFin Registered Member Join Date: Mar 2016 Location: Portland, OR Posts: 2,032	I'm guessing the cocktail of nopox, stresscoat, and stability is what caused everything to go south. I don't use them, but I know Red Sea warns against using any chemical absorbers/neutralizers with nopox (Like stress coat.) Any particular reason for using them? Are you using tap water? __________________ Brian Current Tank Info: 110 gallon

06/08/2017, 03:39 PM	#13
Sk8r RC Mod Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: Spokane WA Posts: 34,628 Blog Entries: 55	I would agree. Rather than use stresscoat, keep your alkalinity about 8.3 and your salinity stable. Fish have natural defenses if given half a chance, so they don't need the stresscoat unless there's something bad going on. Generally, they produce a good slime coat all on their own. __________________ Sk8r Salinity 1.024-6; alkalinity 8.3-9.3 on KH scale; calcium 420; magnesium 1300, temp 78-80, nitrate .2. Ammonia 0. No filters: lps tank. Alk and cal won't rise if mg is low. Current Tank Info: 105g AquaVim wedge, yellow tang, sailfin blenny,royal gramma, ocellaris clown pair, yellow watchman, 100 microceriths, 25 tiny hermits, a 4" conch, 1" nassarius, recovering from 2 year hiatus with daily water change of 10%.

06/08/2017, 03:46 PM	#14
Tripod1404 Registered Member Join Date: Mar 2016 Posts: 1,821	Stress coat contain Aloe Vera extract ,so it is a carbon source. Mixing that with nopox might have caused an overdose of carbon which would result in bacteria bloom. If this is the case, bacteria would consume the oxygen and fish would suffocate. It would also make the skimmer go crazy.

06/09/2017, 12:26 PM	#19
TokiHacker Registered Member Join Date: Jan 2017 Location: Mobile, Alabama Posts: 549	An nopox to lower the nitrates to 5ppm and stability because I just always have.... maybe being a creature of habit isn't always the best thing... __________________ 200 GAL Mixed Reef Build \| 20GAL JBJ Frag Tank \| 29GAL Chiragra Mantis Shrimp Tank

06/10/2017, 09:31 AM	#20
Sounds Fishy Registered Member Join Date: Jul 2015 Location: Canada Posts: 532	Has your Singapore angel survived?I hope so,because they really are delicate,and very nice fish.Two things I know about stress coat.The reason it is supposed to work is because it encourages the slime on fish to thicken,however,in order to achieve this the product irritates the fishs' outer coat ( thus stimulating the slime to grow to protect the fish from the product you added).That seems counter productive. Also,your skimmer just removes it from the water,anyway.So why bother... No pox is a good product. Sounds maybe you love you fish so much you tried to give them every oppourtunity at a good life by adding a few things that are supposed to help keep everything in good condition,however,sometimes( and in hind sight), just doing regular water changes is the best solution. __________________ Blue Spotted Ribbontail Stingray.Zebra Moray Eel.Aqueon 210 gallon,Trigger Ruby Elite 36 gallon sump Last edited by Sounds Fishy; 06/10/2017 at 09:39 AM.

06/13/2017, 12:42 PM	#21
TokiHacker Registered Member Join Date: Jan 2017 Location: Mobile, Alabama Posts: 549	sadly no... and I lost my blue jaw trigger... crushing.... but going to do some more water changes and keep at it. __________________ 200 GAL Mixed Reef Build \| 20GAL JBJ Frag Tank \| 29GAL Chiragra Mantis Shrimp Tank

06/14/2017, 02:18 AM	#22
jalisco Registered Member Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: North Bay Area, Peoples Republic of Kalifornia Posts: 325	Sorry for your loss.

06/15/2017, 10:46 PM	#23
Coralfuture Registered Member Join Date: Jul 2016 Location: Milwaukee, WI Posts: 76	Sorry to hear about the losses I hope you can salvage what's left