Salt Mixes and whats advertised on box

lowtek · 10/13/2018, 01:27 PM

Hello all. So having been in this hobby for going on a year now, Ive had the chance of using a good bit of salt. I cycled my tank with Instant Ocean, switched to Red Sea pro for 2 175g buckets which I got on sale way back, then switched IO reef crystals for cost reaaons for about two boxes so far.
After using the R. Crystals, I can't say that they are too cost effective because you dont get the 200 gallons they say you get. Why?
Because we or at least I dont keep my Salinity at 1.023! Kind of misleading in my opinion. I have to use almost a whole pound more of salt which really makes I dont know maybe 160g of inconsistent results saltwater?
I dont know the exact math but Im willing to try a different salt brand that doesnt hit as hard as red sea pro. I'm not a fan of high alk either so thats what turnes me off about red sea and elevated price. I dose kalk right now anyway. So Im not looking for steroid salt just something that keeps me around:
1.025 salt
430 cal
9 alk
1330-1350 mag
which is about my tank numbers. Reef crystal varies too much for me and they go by a B.S. 1.023 salinity which I just cant get over. OR is it possible to run a reef at 1.023? Any suggestions?

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OpPrime · 10/13/2018, 01:31 PM

Try Tropic Marin

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billdogg · 10/13/2018, 02:04 PM

I use IO or IORC pretty much all the time. Not that I haven't tried most of the others over the years. Cost and availability are a couple of the reasons.

FWIW - I use 1 x 50g bag + ~6 cups for my 55g mixing barrel. Doesn't really matter what brand, IME, they all mix up just a bit short of 1.026 if you follow the directions.

mcgyvr · 10/13/2018, 02:52 PM

It is absolutely possible to run 1.023 or even less with corals..

lowtek · 10/13/2018, 02:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by billdogg

I use IO or IORC pretty much all the time. Not that I haven't tried most of the others over the years. Cost and availability are a couple of the reasons.

FWIW - I use 1 x 50g bag + ~6 cups for my 55g mixing barrel. Doesn't really matter what brand, IME, they all mix up just a bit short of 1.026 if you follow the directions.

So its all basically a "individual results may vary" thing when it comes to salts is what Im seeing. Guess thats one reason why they say this is an expensive hobby.

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lowtek · 10/13/2018, 02:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mcgyvr

It is absolutely possible to run 1.023 or even less with corals..

Having said that, I guess the question is what kind of corals/reef tank I can run at that number?

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mcgyvr · 10/13/2018, 04:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by lowtek

Having said that, I guess the question is what kind of corals/reef tank I can run at that number?

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Anything will be just fine with that..

OpPrime · 10/13/2018, 04:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mcgyvr

Anything will be just fine with that..

I thought at certain low salinities the water will leach minerals from the corals.

Where as good higher salinity levels promote the coral to absorb nutrients.

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lowtek · 10/13/2018, 05:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mcgyvr

Anything will be just fine with that..

Makes sense. If you dont stray too far from natural sea levels Im guessing. I will have to look into that. I change like 60-70 gallons a month for now. So the less salt I use the better.

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Uncle99 · 10/13/2018, 07:19 PM

I am currently running a QT at 1.019 and my LFS runs SW fish only at 1.019.
So running fish at 1.023, sure, and preferable, but too low for my taste for corals, those I run at 1.0255

I have tried a lot of brands over the years, found no real difference with exception to amounts of supplemental,dosing required.

lowtek · 10/13/2018, 07:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Uncle99

I am currently running a QT at 1.019 and my LFS runs SW fish only at 1.019.
So running fish at 1.023, sure, and preferable, but too low for my taste for corals, those I run at 1.0255

I have tried a lot of brands over the years, found no real difference with exception to amounts of supplemental,dosing required.

Yeah thats my whole point. I know fish only you can dip a bit low. (My lfs holds fish at 1.020. But frag tanks at 1.026.) But not so sure about a reef tank. And thats what bugs me about companies advertising 200 gallons at 1.023 salinity. Some say 1.023 is sufficient though. Im new in this hobby. So, I guess inaccurate salt mix numbers just comes with the territory. I will look into that tropic marine salt though.

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lowtek · 10/13/2018, 08:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by lowtek

Yeah thats my whole point. I know fish only you can dip a bit low. (My lfs holds fish at 1.020. But frag tanks at 1.026.) But not so sure about a reef tank. And thats what bugs me about companies advertising 200 gallons at 1.023 salinity. Some say 1.023 is sufficient though. Im new in this hobby. So, I guess inaccurate salt mix numbers just comes with the territory. I will look into that tropic marine salt though.

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Uhhh yeah tropic marin is out. That stuff is like twice as much as red sea! Crazy.

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lowtek · 10/13/2018, 11:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by lowtek

Uhhh yeah tropic marin is out. That stuff is like twice as much as red sea! Crazy.

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Sorry jumped the gun. Only one site had that crazy price.

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EMeyer · 10/14/2018, 07:18 AM

to answer the direct question, fish and to a lesser extent corals can tolerate unnaturally low salinities like 31 ppt (=1.023 sg). (meanwhile, the ocean is 35 basically everywhere except for estuaries and restricted basins like the Persian gulf).

Since there is little or no good reason to run a reef tank at such an unnaturally low salinity, I share your frustration and think it should be required to state on the packaging the volume normal, full-strength seawater that can be prepared from a batch of salt rather than inflating the yield with a non-standard salinity.

People may say "but wait, my tank runs that low"
1. a large fraction of people miscalibrate or don't calibrate their refractometers, or use inaccurate methods like a swing arm hydrometer. the salinity in your tank may not actually be what you think it is.
2. even if so, consider the effect on calcification ions! If you maintain normal seawater composition, at 31 ppt both the Ca and Alkalinity are lower than normal seawater.

hkgar · 10/14/2018, 12:59 PM

I buy my salt based on the dKH level I like to keep (7.8) and use Red sea blue bucket.

https://www.thatpetplace.com/salt-mix-guide

lowtek · 10/14/2018, 01:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by EMeyer

to answer the direct question, fish and to a lesser extent corals can tolerate unnaturally low salinities like 31 ppt (=1.023 sg). (meanwhile, the ocean is 35 basically everywhere except for estuaries and restricted basins like the Persian gulf).

Since there is little or no good reason to run a reef tank at such an unnaturally low salinity, I share your frustration and think it should be required to state on the packaging the volume normal, full-strength seawater that can be prepared from a batch of salt rather than inflating the yield with a non-standard salinity.

People may say "but wait, my tank runs that low"
1. a large fraction of people miscalibrate or don't calibrate their refractometers, or use inaccurate methods like a swing arm hydrometer. the salinity in your tank may not actually be what you think it is.
2. even if so, consider the effect on calcification ions! If you maintain normal seawater composition, at 31 ppt both the Ca and Alkalinity are lower than normal seawater.

You really touched on exactly how I started to feel after going through a few boxes. I have to use about 20% more salt than what is instructed. Red Sea pro I admit I had to adjust way less than what i had to with IO Reef. But red sea pro over does it with alk imo.
Havnt tried the blue bucket RS though. To me running at 1.023 for a reef is a crash waiting to happen. Even with fish only systems. Given that oceans all over, besides areas common to brackish waters are naturally at 35ppt 1.026.

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btmedic04 · 10/17/2018, 07:39 PM

Might want to take a look at hw-Marinemix Reefer Salt found HERE at BRS. The parameters are close to what you specified and are mixed at 35ppt salinity. I was looking at red sea coral pro for my nuvo fusion 20 that I'm starting, but that 12+dkh has me concerned that I'll burn out any corals I put in there. For that reason, I'm considering the hw-marinemix reefer salt

lowtek · 10/17/2018, 08:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by btmedic04

Might want to take a look at hw-Marinemix Reefer Salt found HERE at BRS. The parameters are close to what you specified and are mixed at 35ppt salinity. I was looking at red sea coral pro for my nuvo fusion 20 that I'm starting, but that 12+dkh has me concerned that I'll burn out any corals I put in there. For that reason, I'm considering the hw-marinemix reefer salt

Yeah I was looking at that one along with tropic marin salt they both. Have good reviews and everyone who uses them says they are both very consistent. Rather pay more for consistency rather than steroids. Thanks for your input thoufh🖒

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Uncle99 · 10/18/2018, 12:07 PM

The use of the equation 1.023 = X gallons is used by the consumer to equate price per gallon between a ton of manufactures of the same.

Many seem to buy the cheapest salt possible in terms of amount of saltwater.

Remember, you usually get what you paid for.

Your water (and light) are your most important factors.

I use Red Sea Pro, and while it mixes high in the range, when added as a WC, mellows right down.
Just means I have to dose less CA-Alk-mg, so my cost savings may come here...

10/13/2018, 01:27 PM	#1
lowtek Registered Member Join Date: Apr 2015 Location: Pacific Northwest Posts: 111	Salt Mixes and whats advertised on box Hello all. So having been in this hobby for going on a year now, Ive had the chance of using a good bit of salt. I cycled my tank with Instant Ocean, switched to Red Sea pro for 2 175g buckets which I got on sale way back, then switched IO reef crystals for cost reaaons for about two boxes so far. After using the R. Crystals, I can't say that they are too cost effective because you dont get the 200 gallons they say you get. Why? Because we or at least I dont keep my Salinity at 1.023! Kind of misleading in my opinion. I have to use almost a whole pound more of salt which really makes I dont know maybe 160g of inconsistent results saltwater? I dont know the exact math but Im willing to try a different salt brand that doesnt hit as hard as red sea pro. I'm not a fan of high alk either so thats what turnes me off about red sea and elevated price. I dose kalk right now anyway. So Im not looking for steroid salt just something that keeps me around: 1.025 salt 430 cal 9 alk 1330-1350 mag which is about my tank numbers. Reef crystal varies too much for me and they go by a B.S. 1.023 salinity which I just cant get over. OR is it possible to run a reef at 1.023? Any suggestions? Sent from my SM-G935P using Tapatalk

10/13/2018, 02:04 PM	#3
billdogg Registered Member Join Date: Apr 2008 Location: Grove City, Ohio Posts: 10,806	I use IO or IORC pretty much all the time. Not that I haven't tried most of the others over the years. Cost and availability are a couple of the reasons. FWIW - I use 1 x 50g bag + ~6 cups for my 55g mixing barrel. Doesn't really matter what brand, IME, they all mix up just a bit short of 1.026 if you follow the directions. __________________ I'll try to be nice if you try to be smarter! I can't help that I grow older, but you can't make me grow up! Current Tank Info: 120 mixed reef with 40b sump, RO 150 skimmer, AI Sol Blue x 2, and a 60g Frag Tank with 100g rubbermaid sump. 2 x Kessil A360w lights, BM curve 5 skimmer

10/13/2018, 02:52 PM	#4
mcgyvr Registered Member Join Date: Sep 2003 Location: North Carolina Posts: 20,050	It is absolutely possible to run 1.023 or even less with corals.. __________________ Who me?

10/14/2018, 12:59 PM	#15
hkgar Registered Member Join Date: Oct 2002 Location: Dewitt MI Posts: 5,051	I buy my salt based on the dKH level I like to keep (7.8) and use Red sea blue bucket. https://www.thatpetplace.com/salt-mix-guide __________________ Gary 180 gallon, 40 gallon sump, 3 250 W MH + 4 80W ATI T5's, MTC MVX 36 Skimmer, Apex controller Aquamaxx T-3 CaRx Current Tank Info: A 2 Barred Rabbitfish, Red Head Salon, Yellow/Purple, McMaster Fairy, Possum, 2 Leopard Wrasses, Kole, & Atlantic Blue Tangs, 2 Percula Clown, 3 PJ and 1 Banggai Cardinalfish , Swallowtail, Bellus and Coral Beauty Angels

10/17/2018, 07:39 PM	#17
btmedic04 Registered Member Join Date: Sep 2013 Location: Ohio Posts: 256	Might want to take a look at hw-Marinemix Reefer Salt found HERE at BRS. The parameters are close to what you specified and are mixed at 35ppt salinity. I was looking at red sea coral pro for my nuvo fusion 20 that I'm starting, but that 12+dkh has me concerned that I'll burn out any corals I put in there. For that reason, I'm considering the hw-marinemix reefer salt __________________ Current Tanks: New build in progress :)

10/13/2018, 01:31 PM	#2
OpPrime Registered Member Join Date: Oct 2018 Posts: 20	Try Tropic Marin Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

10/13/2018, 07:19 PM	#10
Uncle99 Crab Free Zone Join Date: Sep 2017 Location: Ontario, Canada Posts: 2,906	I am currently running a QT at 1.019 and my LFS runs SW fish only at 1.019. So running fish at 1.023, sure, and preferable, but too low for my taste for corals, those I run at 1.0255 I have tried a lot of brands over the years, found no real difference with exception to amounts of supplemental,dosing required.

10/14/2018, 07:18 AM	#14
EMeyer Registered Member Join Date: Mar 2016 Posts: 173	to answer the direct question, fish and to a lesser extent corals can tolerate unnaturally low salinities like 31 ppt (=1.023 sg). (meanwhile, the ocean is 35 basically everywhere except for estuaries and restricted basins like the Persian gulf). Since there is little or no good reason to run a reef tank at such an unnaturally low salinity, I share your frustration and think it should be required to state on the packaging the volume normal, full-strength seawater that can be prepared from a batch of salt rather than inflating the yield with a non-standard salinity. People may say "but wait, my tank runs that low" 1. a large fraction of people miscalibrate or don't calibrate their refractometers, or use inaccurate methods like a swing arm hydrometer. the salinity in your tank may not actually be what you think it is. 2. even if so, consider the effect on calcification ions! If you maintain normal seawater composition, at 31 ppt both the Ca and Alkalinity are lower than normal seawater.

10/18/2018, 12:07 PM	#19
Uncle99 Crab Free Zone Join Date: Sep 2017 Location: Ontario, Canada Posts: 2,906	The use of the equation 1.023 = X gallons is used by the consumer to equate price per gallon between a ton of manufactures of the same. Many seem to buy the cheapest salt possible in terms of amount of saltwater. Remember, you usually get what you paid for. Your water (and light) are your most important factors. I use Red Sea Pro, and while it mixes high in the range, when added as a WC, mellows right down. Just means I have to dose less CA-Alk-mg, so my cost savings may come here...