is my clam dead? help!

rctradertwo · 02/16/2005, 12:19 PM

i just got a dersa on monday. at the lfs it was opened up but the mantle wasnt extended past the shell. it was pumping water so i thought that it would be healthy. got it home and added a little water every 5 min for a 1/2 hour. after a 1/2 hour i emptied out half of the water in his bag and refilled it with my tank water. i then let it sit for about 15 - 20. after i put him in he fully opened and began filtering. the mantle was extended past the shell for a little while. it kept opening up wide then shutting fast for the first couple hours ( i figured was normal). the next day( yesterday) the mantle was recessed and i could see about 1/4 inch of the inside of his shell and it was wide open. now it is wide open and the mantle is loosely folded over onto itself and i reached in and gave the shell a little squeeze to see if it would shut and it didnt even move. the excurrent siphon is completely collapsed and it is obviously not pumping water. so please help! is it just in shock do to environment change or is it dead... sorry i dont have a pic right now but i could get one tonight. it is about 3" across (when open)and about 3" long. my water is :
nitrates - 10
phos - 0.1
sal. - 1.025
amm - 0
nitrite - 0
temp - 82
ph - 8.3

lighting - 175w 15k MH with a day bulb (PC)

Barry N. · 02/16/2005, 02:15 PM

If the mantles are retracted back into the shell and shows no signs of movement to the touch then I would say it is dead or just about dead.

rctradertwo · 02/16/2005, 02:34 PM

if figured it was pretty obvious that it is dead but i am just hoping that it wasnt since i just paid $69 for the darn thing and it only lasted a couple of hours. can anyone see anything that i could have done wrong that could keep my next one alive...if there is a next one. also if it is boarder line dead is there anything i can do to revive it......CPR?
thanks

Jeremy Blaze · 02/16/2005, 02:56 PM

Sounds like it was on its way out when you got it. I would never purchese a clam with its mantle not extending past the shell, unless of course it was a hippopus!

TaterInTheSouth · 02/16/2005, 04:21 PM

You always hope the LFS acclimates critters correctly as well,
I have seen the hired help float and dump too many times
at too many places though...

On your end, while your technique is considered by many to be
correct, Not saying it's wrong.. I prefer dripping over several
hours and slowly speeding it up over the last 30-45 mins for
the temp to equalize. I think 82 is a tad warm though..HTH

rctradertwo · 02/16/2005, 11:08 PM

well the final verdict is that it is dead! so thanks for all your replies. the lfs is very good and i do trust them. i have dealt with them for the past 2 years and all of their livestock is healthy. also the clams that were there have been in stock for the past 3 weeks. i took it back and got some money back (1/2). they told me that bristle/ fireworms could have been the cause ( i do have alot) since they tested my water and found nothing. so now i have a bristle worm trap and they recommended that i dont try again until i cure the bristle worm prob. what are your thoughts on this? also i have been wondering about the 82 degrees myself. i have had so many problems dialing in a variable thermostat that i purcahased the dual setting 72/ 82 degree heater. i think that 72 would be to cold and i went with the 82 which from what i have read is pretty much the max. i really would like to have some input on this topic and may have to post another thread in the main stream.

chrowski · 02/17/2005, 08:38 AM

combine Jeremy Blaze's comment and TaterInTheSouth's comment and I think you should have a living dersa in no time ...when I fist was reading you acclimation methods I had to think about that being the problem...but its just personal preferance (drip it!!)

Barry N. · 02/17/2005, 10:47 AM

Quote:

drip it!!

IN what?

d4a2n0k · 02/17/2005, 03:35 PM

Sounds like your LFS is working with information from 20 years ago. It is well known that the common bristleworm will not eat something that is alive. They are detritus eaters. There are some worms that very rarely show up in live rock that will eat living creatures but these are more the exception rather than the rule.

Many people see bristleworms eating dead creatures and automatically think that they killed it, that is not the case. They will only eat dead/dieing creatures.

Leave your bristleworms, they are good.

It sounds like your Derasa was already on his way out when you bought him.

Jeremy Blaze · 02/17/2005, 03:37 PM

I agree. Leave your bristle worms in! They are good!

Jovreefer · 02/17/2005, 04:47 PM

I'm by far no expert but I've herd alot that bristle worms will irratate the clam (no eat just bother to the point of stressing it to death) and when I got my clam I was told to put a shell in the sand underneith the clam so the worms could not burrow to it and bother it.

saltyunderground · 02/19/2005, 06:48 AM

If you have nitrate readings, I would not have a clam. Water quality is important. Also, at least 2 hours of drip acclamation is important too. I have many clams and have had no problems with these two important factors followed.

Azurel · 02/19/2005, 03:36 PM

I have read some articles by D. knop that nitrate is filtered out by clams and used as an energy source for the symbiotic algea, now in high concentrations it is not good for any marine animal, but nitrates in low parameters will not harm the clams.

02/16/2005, 12:19 PM	#1
rctradertwo Registered Member Join Date: Jan 2004 Location: Wintersville, oh Posts: 29	is my clam dead? help! i just got a dersa on monday. at the lfs it was opened up but the mantle wasnt extended past the shell. it was pumping water so i thought that it would be healthy. got it home and added a little water every 5 min for a 1/2 hour. after a 1/2 hour i emptied out half of the water in his bag and refilled it with my tank water. i then let it sit for about 15 - 20. after i put him in he fully opened and began filtering. the mantle was extended past the shell for a little while. it kept opening up wide then shutting fast for the first couple hours ( i figured was normal). the next day( yesterday) the mantle was recessed and i could see about 1/4 inch of the inside of his shell and it was wide open. now it is wide open and the mantle is loosely folded over onto itself and i reached in and gave the shell a little squeeze to see if it would shut and it didnt even move. the excurrent siphon is completely collapsed and it is obviously not pumping water. so please help! is it just in shock do to environment change or is it dead... sorry i dont have a pic right now but i could get one tonight. it is about 3" across (when open)and about 3" long. my water is : nitrates - 10 phos - 0.1 sal. - 1.025 amm - 0 nitrite - 0 temp - 82 ph - 8.3 lighting - 175w 15k MH with a day bulb (PC)

02/16/2005, 02:56 PM	#4
Jeremy Blaze Former Reef Addict Join Date: May 2003 Location: New Washington, IN Posts: 5,864	Sounds like it was on its way out when you got it. I would never purchese a clam with its mantle not extending past the shell, unless of course it was a hippopus! __________________ Trust me my friend, the names are not important at all. I've own hundreds of different zoas and palys and don't know the name of a single one. In my opinion, they are a waste of valuable time. Mucho Reef

02/16/2005, 04:21 PM	#5
TaterInTheSouth Registered Member Join Date: May 2003 Location: MS Posts: 109	You always hope the LFS acclimates critters correctly as well, I have seen the hired help float and dump too many times at too many places though... On your end, while your technique is considered by many to be correct, Not saying it's wrong.. I prefer dripping over several hours and slowly speeding it up over the last 30-45 mins for the temp to equalize. I think 82 is a tad warm though..HTH __________________ Tater Current Tank Info: reestablishing 200 gal. reef.

02/16/2005, 11:08 PM	#6
rctradertwo Registered Member Join Date: Jan 2004 Location: Wintersville, oh Posts: 29	DEAD! well the final verdict is that it is dead! so thanks for all your replies. the lfs is very good and i do trust them. i have dealt with them for the past 2 years and all of their livestock is healthy. also the clams that were there have been in stock for the past 3 weeks. i took it back and got some money back (1/2). they told me that bristle/ fireworms could have been the cause ( i do have alot) since they tested my water and found nothing. so now i have a bristle worm trap and they recommended that i dont try again until i cure the bristle worm prob. what are your thoughts on this? also i have been wondering about the 82 degrees myself. i have had so many problems dialing in a variable thermostat that i purcahased the dual setting 72/ 82 degree heater. i think that 72 would be to cold and i went with the 82 which from what i have read is pretty much the max. i really would like to have some input on this topic and may have to post another thread in the main stream.

02/17/2005, 08:38 AM	#7
chrowski Registered Member Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: Hillsborough, New Jersey Posts: 378	combine Jeremy Blaze's comment and TaterInTheSouth's comment and I think you should have a living dersa in no time ...when I fist was reading you acclimation methods I had to think about that being the problem...but its just personal preferance (drip it!!) __________________ --tom Current Tank Info: 30 gallon SPS tank (developing)

02/16/2005, 02:15 PM	#2
Barry N. Registered Member Join Date: Apr 2004 Location: San Diego Posts: 475	If the mantles are retracted back into the shell and shows no signs of movement to the touch then I would say it is dead or just about dead.

02/16/2005, 02:34 PM	#3
rctradertwo Registered Member Join Date: Jan 2004 Location: Wintersville, oh Posts: 29	if figured it was pretty obvious that it is dead but i am just hoping that it wasnt since i just paid $69 for the darn thing and it only lasted a couple of hours. can anyone see anything that i could have done wrong that could keep my next one alive...if there is a next one. also if it is boarder line dead is there anything i can do to revive it......CPR? thanks

02/17/2005, 03:35 PM	#9
d4a2n0k Registered Member Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: Long Island, NY Posts: 2,485	Sounds like your LFS is working with information from 20 years ago. It is well known that the common bristleworm will not eat something that is alive. They are detritus eaters. There are some worms that very rarely show up in live rock that will eat living creatures but these are more the exception rather than the rule. Many people see bristleworms eating dead creatures and automatically think that they killed it, that is not the case. They will only eat dead/dieing creatures. Leave your bristleworms, they are good. It sounds like your Derasa was already on his way out when you bought him.

02/17/2005, 03:37 PM	#10
Jeremy Blaze Former Reef Addict Join Date: May 2003 Location: New Washington, IN Posts: 5,864	I agree. Leave your bristle worms in! They are good! __________________ Trust me my friend, the names are not important at all. I've own hundreds of different zoas and palys and don't know the name of a single one. In my opinion, they are a waste of valuable time. Mucho Reef

02/17/2005, 04:47 PM	#11
Jovreefer Registered Member Join Date: Nov 2003 Location: In my tank Posts: 2,462	I'm by far no expert but I've herd alot that bristle worms will irratate the clam (no eat just bother to the point of stressing it to death) and when I got my clam I was told to put a shell in the sand underneith the clam so the worms could not burrow to it and bother it. __________________ Men occasionally stumble over the truth, but most of them pick themselves up and hurry off as if nothing ever happened.

02/19/2005, 06:48 AM	#12
saltyunderground Moved On Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: Webster Groves, MO Posts: 1,586	If you have nitrate readings, I would not have a clam. Water quality is important. Also, at least 2 hours of drip acclamation is important too. I have many clams and have had no problems with these two important factors followed.

02/19/2005, 03:36 PM	#13
Azurel Registered Member. Join Date: Apr 2003 Location: Kalamazoo,MI Posts: 2,854	I have read some articles by D. knop that nitrate is filtered out by clams and used as an energy source for the symbiotic algea, now in high concentrations it is not good for any marine animal, but nitrates in low parameters will not harm the clams. __________________ Official soldier of the Zoa patrol/ The Zoa Patrol does not exist in public or privet....