Possibly unhealthy frog spawn?

p0rkch0p · 08/15/2006, 11:28 PM

Hi everyone, I have a 95 gal reef tank, not very heavily stocked, that has been running since early April. I added some tree coral first, that is doing fine (and starting to take over my tank, dang that stuff splits and grows like weeds). About a month, month in a half ago I added a frog spawn and a pink finger coral. Initially they looked great, both of them opened up in less than a day. I figured everthing was cool, havent added anything new, but about a week ago I came back from a weekend out of town and noticed the frog spawn was closed up, not as much as it does at night, but definitely not the free flowing shape it was. It seems to be getting worse, and I can't see any obvious problems. When I first checked, my nitrates were a little high (40-60), I did a water change of about 10%, everthing else was normal. The other corals are still doing fine. Any ideas on what this could be? What should I be looking for? Thanks in advance.

Dubbin1 · 08/15/2006, 11:46 PM

IMO you are a little on the low side on light. Im guessing that 2 of the bulbs in your light are actinic so that really only leaves you with 130w of usable light.

Now by doing a 10% water change only lowered those nitrates by 10% (not much). What do all of your other tests read?

JRistau81 · 08/16/2006, 12:03 AM

Forty to Sixty is not a little high. That is extremely high IMO. Think about it. These corals come from the ocean where biologists measure nitrates in parts per BILLION and get less than 10 in the most nutrient rich environments. You test kit is testing in parts per MILLION. I'm pretty sure that that means you have about 40,000 times more nitrate than these corals would have in the ocean. Also consider that that is not a completely accurate reading as some NO3 is being broken down into N2. A nitrate spike almost always means an ammonia spike so that could also be what caused the problem.

p0rkch0p · 08/16/2006, 10:46 AM

Dubbin, you are right on the light, 2 of them are actinics. Other tests have been flat, at zero pretty much the whole time. I have not done another full water test in the last couple of days, I will do that tonight after work to see where everything is. According to my controller, my ph wanders between 8.08 and 8.12 through the day, and temp 78-79. JR, I see your point on the nitrates, I will work on getting that down. I pulled the bio balls out of the sump, thought that would help my nitrate problem (but then again, I was having issues with my skimmer a little while ago), the other possibility is my auto feeder is dumping too much into the tank while I was out of town. So, in your opinion (IYO?

), high nitrates could be the cause here?

Dubbin1 · 08/16/2006, 10:54 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by p0rkch0p
high nitrates could be the cause here?

They very well could be. You are going to need to do a bunch of small water changes or a few larger ones to get the nitrates down to an acceptable level.

p0rkch0p · 08/16/2006, 09:26 PM

Ok, I will get started on that process, thanks Dubbin. Also, noticed the Piston in your sig, you from MI? I grew up out there...

CeeGee · 08/16/2006, 10:43 PM

you didn't pull all the bio-balls at once did you? That could be a catastrophe.

Are you running a fuge? Growing some chaeto could help with the nitrates.

Dubbin1 · 08/16/2006, 11:49 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by p0rkch0p
Ok, I will get started on that process, thanks Dubbin. Also, noticed the Piston in your sig, you from MI? I grew up out there...

I lived in Rochester Hills for a few years but I am from NW Ohio.

p0rkch0p · 08/17/2006, 10:27 AM

Ceegee, no, I pulled the bio balls gradually, probably a quarter at a time, they were all out before I added the new coral. The only thing having a problem is the frog spawn, the other finger and tree coral are fine, as are the fish and shrimp. I did another water test last night, everything is fine, all zero's with the exception of nitrates which are still high. I am doing another water change today, and probably another tomorrow (I only have 2 5 gallon jugs and my RO system takes a while to fill them).

Oh, and yeah, I grew up in Jackson, but have lived in CA now long enough to be a native I think. I was just back in MI a couple weeks ago on vacation, family still lives back there. Thanks for the suggestions/information.

p0rkch0p · 08/17/2006, 10:29 AM

Oh, yeah, and no fuge.....One thing I did leave in after the bio balls was the sponge and the drip tray. Would it be better to pull that out as well? I have about 130 lbs of rock in the tank, and 140 lbs of live sand.

GlobaLPimP · 08/17/2006, 11:04 AM

I removed my drip tray so that I could add a filter sock, but I left the sponge because it stops the microbubles created by my skimmer return in that side.

08/15/2006, 11:28 PM	#1
p0rkch0p Registered Member Join Date: May 2006 Location: Northern California Posts: 30	Possibly unhealthy frog spawn? Hi everyone, I have a 95 gal reef tank, not very heavily stocked, that has been running since early April. I added some tree coral first, that is doing fine (and starting to take over my tank, dang that stuff splits and grows like weeds). About a month, month in a half ago I added a frog spawn and a pink finger coral. Initially they looked great, both of them opened up in less than a day. I figured everthing was cool, havent added anything new, but about a week ago I came back from a weekend out of town and noticed the frog spawn was closed up, not as much as it does at night, but definitely not the free flowing shape it was. It seems to be getting worse, and I can't see any obvious problems. When I first checked, my nitrates were a little high (40-60), I did a water change of about 10%, everthing else was normal. The other corals are still doing fine. Any ideas on what this could be? What should I be looking for? Thanks in advance.

08/16/2006, 12:03 AM	#3
JRistau81 Registered Member Join Date: May 2006 Location: Springfield, Illinois Posts: 264	Forty to Sixty is not a little high. That is extremely high IMO. Think about it. These corals come from the ocean where biologists measure nitrates in parts per BILLION and get less than 10 in the most nutrient rich environments. You test kit is testing in parts per MILLION. I'm pretty sure that that means you have about 40,000 times more nitrate than these corals would have in the ocean. Also consider that that is not a completely accurate reading as some NO3 is being broken down into N2. A nitrate spike almost always means an ammonia spike so that could also be what caused the problem. __________________ I like pigs. Dogs look up to us; cats look down on us, but pigs treat us as equals. - Winston Churchill Current Tank Info: 150 gallon, 2 Hamilton 400w 14K Metal halide, Red Sea Berlin Skimmer (Don't scoff, it works well), 150-200 lbs LR, 50 lbs LS, 100 lbs Southdown...anything else?

08/16/2006, 10:43 PM	#7
CeeGee Registered Member Join Date: Jun 2002 Location: TN Posts: 3,272	you didn't pull all the bio-balls at once did you? That could be a catastrophe. Are you running a fuge? Growing some chaeto could help with the nitrates. __________________ My algae WAS special. Current Tank Info: 75 gallon display, 40 gallon breeder sump, RLSS R6i, ATI Powermodule, Apex, Ecotech MP40's

08/17/2006, 11:04 AM	#11
GlobaLPimP Registered Member Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: Palm Harbor, Florida Posts: 911	I removed my drip tray so that I could add a filter sock, but I left the sponge because it stops the microbubles created by my skimmer return in that side. __________________ This hobby is educational; it teaches you how to spend a lot of money in a hurry! Current Tank Info: 75gl, SPS, LPS, IceCap/T5/SLR, 2 modded Tunze 6045's, PCI 350 skimmer w/ Gen-X 2400, 95lbs LR, GEN-X 4100 return

08/15/2006, 11:46 PM	#2
Dubbin1 Registered Member Join Date: Mar 2004 Location: Findlay, Ohio Posts: 11,540	IMO you are a little on the low side on light. Im guessing that 2 of the bulbs in your light are actinic so that really only leaves you with 130w of usable light. Now by doing a 10% water change only lowered those nitrates by 10% (not much). What do all of your other tests read?

08/16/2006, 10:46 AM	#4
p0rkch0p Registered Member Join Date: May 2006 Location: Northern California Posts: 30	Dubbin, you are right on the light, 2 of them are actinics. Other tests have been flat, at zero pretty much the whole time. I have not done another full water test in the last couple of days, I will do that tonight after work to see where everything is. According to my controller, my ph wanders between 8.08 and 8.12 through the day, and temp 78-79. JR, I see your point on the nitrates, I will work on getting that down. I pulled the bio balls out of the sump, thought that would help my nitrate problem (but then again, I was having issues with my skimmer a little while ago), the other possibility is my auto feeder is dumping too much into the tank while I was out of town. So, in your opinion (IYO? ), high nitrates could be the cause here?

08/16/2006, 09:26 PM	#6
p0rkch0p Registered Member Join Date: May 2006 Location: Northern California Posts: 30	Ok, I will get started on that process, thanks Dubbin. Also, noticed the Piston in your sig, you from MI? I grew up out there...

08/17/2006, 10:27 AM	#9
p0rkch0p Registered Member Join Date: May 2006 Location: Northern California Posts: 30	Ceegee, no, I pulled the bio balls gradually, probably a quarter at a time, they were all out before I added the new coral. The only thing having a problem is the frog spawn, the other finger and tree coral are fine, as are the fish and shrimp. I did another water test last night, everything is fine, all zero's with the exception of nitrates which are still high. I am doing another water change today, and probably another tomorrow (I only have 2 5 gallon jugs and my RO system takes a while to fill them). Oh, and yeah, I grew up in Jackson, but have lived in CA now long enough to be a native I think. I was just back in MI a couple weeks ago on vacation, family still lives back there. Thanks for the suggestions/information.

08/17/2006, 10:29 AM	#10
p0rkch0p Registered Member Join Date: May 2006 Location: Northern California Posts: 30	Oh, yeah, and no fuge.....One thing I did leave in after the bio balls was the sponge and the drip tray. Would it be better to pull that out as well? I have about 130 lbs of rock in the tank, and 140 lbs of live sand.